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Ceridian HCM Holding Inc. (NYSE:CDAY)
Q3 2020 Earnings Call
Nov 05, 2020, 5:00 p.m. ET

Contents:

  • Prepared Remarks
  • Questions and Answers
  • Call Participants

Prepared Remarks:


Operator

OK, Jeremy, I'll turn it over to you.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

Thanks, Nikki. Greetings. My name is Jeremy Johnson, vice president of finance and investor relations at Ceridian. I'd like to welcome everyone to our third-quarter earnings call.

[Operator instructions] As a reminder, this conference is being recorded. On the call today, we have Ceridian's CEO, David Ossip; and CFO, Noemie Heuland. Before I hand the call to David for some brief remarks, allow me to provide a disclaimer regarding forward-looking statements. This call may include forward-looking statements about our current and future outlook, guidance, plans, expectations and intentions, results, levels of activities, performance, goals or achievements, or any other future events or developments.

These statements are based on management's reasonable assumptions and beliefs in light of information currently available to us. Listeners are cautioned not to place undue reliance on such statements. Each forward-looking statement is subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially from those set forth in such statements. We refer you to our previous filings with the SEC for information regarding the significant assumptions underlying forward-looking statements and certain risks and other factors that could affect our future performance and ability to deliver on these statements.

We undertake no obligation to update or to revise any forward-looking statements made on this call, except as may be required by law. Third-quarter stockholder letter, earnings release, and quarterly report on Form 10-Q have been furnished or filed with the SEC and will be available on the SEC's EDGAR database in the U.S. and the SEDAR database in Canada, as well as on the Ceridian Investor Relations website at investors.ceridian.com. With that, I will turn the call over to David.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Thanks, Jeremy, and good evening, everyone, and thank you for joining our earnings call. I hope that everyone is staying healthy and safe. Before we go to Q&A, I want to spend a few minutes on some important points from our stockholder's letter. First, we had a strong quarter.

Dayforce recurring revenue, total revenue, and adjusted EBITDA were above our expectations. Despite COVID-19 headwinds, Dayforce recurring revenue, excluding float, grew by 17.9%. And cloud recurring gross margin increased by 20 basis points to 70.4% and excluding float revenue expanded by 190 basis points. Second, as expected, sales for the third quarter accelerated and were in line with the expectations we had for the business before the COVID-19 pandemic.

For the fourth quarter, we expect double-digit year-over-year sales growth, which would result in the larger sales quarter in our history. Third, Dayforce Wallet continues to go very well, and we remain confident in the wallet strategy. Today, we have more than 60 customers using the wallet, and over 200 more have signed up but are not yet implemented. Our Dayforce Wallet attachment rate to new sales has been approximately 80%, which we expect to lead compounded adoption as those customers are taking live.

And finally, we expect Dayforce recurring revenue growth excluding float and on a constant-currency basis of between 18% to 19% in the fourth quarter and above 19% for the first quarter of 2021, both assuming continued gradual improvement in customer employment levels. I'd like to hand it back to Jeremy to open the call up for questions and answers.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

Thanks, David. As we go through the Q&A portion of this call, I'll announce your name. And at that point, we ask you to please unmute your line, ask your question and then remute your line. We also ask you please limit your time to one question and one follow-up, please.

Thank you. Our first question tonight comes from the line of Alex Zukin. Please go ahead, Alex.

Alex Zukin -- RBC Capital Markets -- Analyst

OK. Thanks, guys, for taking the question. Thanks, Jeremy. Thanks, David.

Can you talk about just the selling environment as it has evolved, both through the quarter that the third quarter? And as you look into the fourth quarter, you even gave guidance for Q1. What have you seen in kind of the sales cycles? What have you seen in the pipelines? What have you seen in win rates? And then also, what you're seeing in kind of retention now that we're so far through the pandemic, and you had customers that had layoffs and furloughs, what you're seeing there would be great.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Sure. So I think there are about five questions in that one. But, yes, thanks for that. And, Alex, always great to speak with you.

Sales in the last quarter, Q3, recovered to pre-COVID levels. So again, if we looked at the budget we had back in January, we had obviously very aggressive sales targets for the year, and Q3 numbers came in line with that. And we're also seeing continued momentum into Q4, so a very robust sell-in environment. And I would say, as far as COVID goes, I believe that the sell-in environment is back to pre-COVID levels.

So we're quite encouraged. We saw wins not only in North America, but if you go through the stockholder letter, you can see we had significant wins on a global basis as well, which is evidence of our move into the enterprise market and as well our expansion globally. In addition, we saw some benefit from the Excelity acquisition. So we're now seeing influence in global customers that have populations across APJ, where we are seeing increased pipeline, increased conversion, and increase influence based on the Excelity acquisition.

So we're very pleased of that. In terms of employment levels, employment levels have come back probably another about 1% since last quarter. So they are still down when we measure it on an average-employee basis for a customer. However, the aggregate number of employees paid on the day ball system is up obviously year over year, and hence, the growth rate that we see of approximately about 17.9% on Dayforce recurring.

Alex Zukin -- RBC Capital Markets -- Analyst

Perfect. And then as a follow-up, if you start thinking about -- you've made a number of new hires to the executive team at the technical level, at the sales level, at the partnership level. When you think about the big initiatives for investors to focus on as we start lapping the COVID compares and you start thinking about the kinds of growth rates that you could put up, even as we think from 1Q to 2Q sequentially, what are the things to pay attention to? What are the growth tailwinds that you see from some of those hires you think we'll be able to bring that we should pay attention to?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Sure. So as we mentioned in the stockholder letter, the hires all have global experience and experience at scale. And so what you'll see from the group that we brought on are two things: one, continued acceleration of sales as we go into next year, and that should translate in the second half of the year back to pre-COVID Dayforce revenue growth levels; and the second thing that you should continue to see is an improvement in profitability because, from a culture perspective, the way I described moving from a start-up culture into one of scale as you go from heroics to having true processes that allow you to scale the company profitably.

Alex Zukin -- RBC Capital Markets -- Analyst

Perfect. Thank you, guys.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

Thanks, Alex. The next question is going to come from the line of Matt Coss from JP Morgan. Go ahead, Matt.

Matt Coss -- J.P. Morgan -- Analyst

Hey, good afternoon. It's Matt Coss on behalf of Mark Murphy. David, digging a little deeper into the 11 large global enterprise deals, were these global vendors? Were these takeaways from global vendors? Were they takeaways from regional ones? And as you look at your partnership with Excelity, do you think Excelity could have won these stand-alone, or is it really the combination of Ceridian with Excelity?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

So there's a combination. As we expand globally, for example, in the U.K., often we are replacing local incumbents. When we talk about deals in Germany and in APJ, often, we are replacing the larger ERP companies or still some incumbent technologies that they might have in place. In terms of Excelity, in some cases, they have won stand-alone deals separate from the Dayforce software.

And in addition, we are seeing, as I mentioned, crossover between the Dayforce sales and added sales from Excelity payroll components.

Matt Coss -- J.P. Morgan -- Analyst

OK. Very good. And then just a little bit of follow-up maybe on Alex's question. So I guess maybe it's obvious that you should return to pre-COVID levels of sales given the improvements in the economy, but I think there are some industries that are still really hurting.

And although unemployment is better than it was, it's so much higher than pre-COVID levels. So just sort of how do you see Ceridian sort of...

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Yes. So, Matt, just one clarification. I don't see sales returning to pre-COVID levels. And Q3 sales were at pre-COVID levels, so I believe the market has already shifted back into a buying-type mode.

We are seeing purchases across the industry. It's not only in what we would have tabled or described as being surge industry. So obviously, we're seeing quite a bit in healthcare, but we are still seeing some of the industries that have been impacted like transportation or recreation still buying systems from us.

Matt Coss -- J.P. Morgan -- Analyst

Thank you.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

The next question is going to come from the line of Siti Panigrahi from Mizuho. Siti, go ahead.

Siti Panigrahi -- Mizuho Securities -- Analyst

Thanks for taking my question. David, last quarter, you talked about very strong incremental revenue from new clients. I'm wondering, how is that trend this quarter? And in fact, you have expanded to a robust product portfolio. So what sort of modules do you see increased traction within your new client base?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

So we are continuing to see strong new sales from new customers. Obviously, we were very happy with the sales that we brought in Q3. The trend of customers buying add-on modules I don't believe has changed materially. We've still seen about 20% of our sales being add-ons to the existing base.

As to what modules? I don't think that's changed either. It's obviously the LMS side, performance compensation. More recently, we have engagement surveys. Dayforce Wallet, although we don't charge a subscription fee.

We are seeing an 80%, 8-0%, attachment rate to new sales.

Siti Panigrahi -- Mizuho Securities -- Analyst

OK. And then a follow-up to that. Historically, December is your big demand for go-live. So I'm wondering, now that you are doing a virtual implementation, how is the pipeline looking for go-live this year?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

We were very happy with the go-live in Q3. And so as we go into Q4, we expect that the go-lives will come in on budget. Obviously, if we compare it year over year, there is some impact from the first two quarters of the year in terms of sales because Q1, Q2, we typically would take live, as you know, in the December time frame. We haven't seen any impact in terms of what I would call go-live productivity issues in terms of working from home and working remotely.

Siti Panigrahi -- Mizuho Securities -- Analyst

That's great. Thank you.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Two examples I'll give you. One is the theater company that I think we went live. Jeremy, it must have been, what, three months?

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

That's right.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

And that was a takeaway from one of our two top competitors. So that was very encouraging. The other one would be a large home healthcare organization with about 30,000 employees, and they went live in about a nine-month period. And obviously, just given where we are now, almost the entire implementation was done remotely, and that's across 5,000 different locations.

So what I would say is that we and our customers have worked out how to use technologies like Zoom that we're using tonight to remain very productive.

Siti Panigrahi -- Mizuho Securities -- Analyst

That's great. And, Noemie, congratulations. Looking forward to working with you.

Noemie Heuland -- Chief Financial Officer

Thank you.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

Thanks, Siti. The next question is going to come from Dan Jester at Citi. Dan, go ahead.

Dan Jester -- Citi -- Analyst

Great. Thanks, everyone. Appreciate the opportunity to ask a question. I guess first, on sort of the wallet, you had a big hire today.

And, David, you've talked about sort of the road map here, new clients, higher attach rate. But can you just help us think about what the wallet could look like a year from now, maybe at high level in terms of the ability to add new features to it? I mean, what's the road map look like at a high level from here?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

So it's a very aggressive road map, but remember, we only started building the wallets about a year ago. And already, we have 60 customers or more than 60 customers that are actively using the wallet. And we have over 200 additional customers that have signed up for the wallet as well. In terms of new capabilities, we'll have a pay card functionality that will come out, I believe, this month.

The pay card functionality allows the wallet to be used for traditional pay card, which means instead of the unbanked or low bank people getting paper checks or having to go to cash checking locations, the organization will be able to give those individuals a Dayforce card, and they'll be able to pay it through that. And so we're expecting to see volume increases through the use of the pay card functionality. Second, we're about to launch the Dayforce Wallet in Canada. And I believe that happens later this month as well.

Ceridian will be the first customer using it, so I personally am actually quite excited to use the actual wallet, which will be great. We're also adding the ability now to do automatic top-up, much like on your Starbucks card, but when it goes below a certain level, automatically, it tops up. And that will be coming out, I believe, in this particular quarter as well. There are aspects of bill pay that we're adding to the actual system.

On a longer-term basis, we'll be moving more to financial wellness. So things like interest-bearing and savings accounts, we call them buckets inside the actual wallet. They will be coming up. And then there's a typical feature that you would expect, things like secondary cards, peer-to-peer transfers, and the like.

So we're quite excited with it. We have insights in two weeks, which is our large customer conference. We're very excited with that. We expect to have over 10,000 attendees, which is about a 5 times increase over the attendance that we saw last year, which talks a little bit about how working remotely and working from home when attached to a proper digital marketing strategy can actually boost pipeline and such.

But we'll be talking a lot about the extension of the wallet beyond just payments.

Dan Jester -- Citi -- Analyst

Great. That's very helpful color. I appreciate it. And then with regards to profitability, this quarter, EBITDA came above your guidance.

And a couple of times in your prepared remarks, you've talked about profitability, scaling the business, etc. So can you help us think about sort of the puts and takes over the next year in terms of the margin? I mean, clearly, you're being impacted by the lack of float income and low interest rates. But on the flip side, you have the benefits of scale and other investments. So how should we think about margins evolving from here? Thank you.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Yes. So first, as employment levels come back, that adds not only to revenue, but it's almost a complete flow down to the bottom line. So for example, if a customer has 1,000 employees versus, say, 1,100 employees, there's no cost difference to us between 1,100 or 1,000. So as employment levels come back, we should see a slight lift as well on the actual profitability side.

We'll see continued improvements from scale, as you mentioned, which effectively come down to lower per employee hosting costs and lower per employee support costs with inside the application as well. In terms of EBITDA, we are going to continue making investments next year. So we'll continue investing in global, in enterprise, in the wallet, and the extension of the wallet that we'll be discussing at insights as well. One point that we should probably call out is that on the EBITDA side, whereas in the second quarter, we did not accrue for bonuses, just based on COVID impact.

In Q3, based on the performance of the company, we did do an accrual for bonus payout for our staff. So the results were actually very strong.

Dan Jester -- Citi -- Analyst

Great. Thank you very much.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

Next question comes from the line of Michael Turrin at Wells Fargo. Michael, go ahead.

Michael Turrin -- Wells Fargo Securities -- Analyst

Hey there. Thanks, everyone. I'm assuming you can hear and maybe even see me OK. I want to just focus in on both kind of the upmarket and the small business trends you're seeing.

I mean, obviously, the upmarket metrics look strong. We continue to note in the shareholder letter, just the size of customers that you're talking about continuing to increase as well. There's also some commentary around some of the smaller businesses that you've seen and some customer losses or churn on that side. It looks like net-net, we would expect upmarket to weigh heavier and no change to your cloud retention expectations, but just want to kind of speak to the push-pull of those two sides.

Thank you.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Yes. So, Michael, let me just start a little bit higher up from that. About 90% of our cloud revenue is Dayforce, and Dayforce is largely targeted what we call major markets and enterprise space. In that population, we've obviously seen a nice improvement in terms of employment levels.

So we've seen it go up slightly from the end of Q2, although still down from what we would have seen in terms of average headcount last year. In terms of Powerpay, which is our small business Canadian-only product, we did see a V-shaped recovery in terms of employment levels, but the recovery level is not yet at the same levels as we saw prior to COVID. And there obviously has been some impact the number of Dayforce clients because as we called out in the shareholder letter, about 80 Powerpay payroll customers that we use in Dayforce time and attendance, went out of business. Now, internal recovery, I would expect a similar pattern.

The smaller the companies are, I think they're more impacted by wave 2 and wave 3, and the different types of lockdowns that you see across jurisdiction, whereas the larger companies typically have more resilience.

Michael Turrin -- Wells Fargo Securities -- Analyst

Helpful. Maybe just a quick follow-on if I may. Noemie, congrats on the new role since we have you here almost live and in person, and David might want to break for a second. Just any initial observations, key priorities, or areas of focus for yourself as you're coming on board and ramping into the new role?

Noemie Heuland -- Chief Financial Officer

All right. Thanks for the question. I'm very happy to be here, actually. I'm very amazed by the leadership team, the culture of the company.

I come from a place where we innovated to serve our customers, and I find that here as well. And the growth is very amazing. I'm excited about the opportunities to further increase our market share. The growth drivers, as David mentioned, the global expansion, the move to the enterprise, are areas that I think I can bring a lot of experience from SAP, and I'm very excited.

Thanks.

Michael Turrin -- Wells Fargo Securities -- Analyst

Excellent. Thank you.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

Our next question comes from the line of Samad Samana from Jefferies. Samad, go ahead.

Samad Samana -- Jefferies -- Analyst

Hi. Good evening. Thanks for taking my question. So, David, first, I'm curious.

We didn't hear much about public sector this quarter. I'm just curious, you've made investments following the push in Canada's modernization side. I'm curious if you have any updates on progress, both on that front, but just more broadly, I know you were saying that it could dovetail into other public sector opportunities. And then one follow-up.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Yes. So on the Canadian government, no update over there, obviously, much slower with COVID. However, we are seeing a lot of traction at the municipal level of government where we've had some nice wins and some nice go-lives, and I expect that will continue.

Samad Samana -- Jefferies -- Analyst

Great. And then during the quarter, we had heard some feedback that maybe there were kind of the sales leadership structure. There is like a regional change there. I'm just curious if -- well, I don't know if that's right or wrong.

But just as a follow-up, we want to make sure we understand if there were any changes or if you could just remind us maybe how that sales leadership is, is working on a regional level? And that's it for me.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Sure. So it's not so much regional. But as you know, we are continually investing in our own organization as we transition from this founder-led culture to one that has more scale and more predictability, and more quality with inside the workforce. And so the changes we made over there was effectively to uplift the sales organization as we do believe that we can see potential for much more productivity out of the sales organization.

Remember, we're saying that even with a very, very high-performing sales organization that executed at pre-COVID levels in the last quarter.

Samad Samana -- Jefferies -- Analyst

Great. Thanks, everyone. That's helpful. And, Noemie, let me just echo the congrats on others for joining and look forward to getting to know you better as well.

Noemie Heuland -- Chief Financial Officer

Thank you. Looking forward to it.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Bryan Bergin at Cowen. Bryan, go ahead.

Bryan Bergin -- Cowen and Company -- Analyst

Thanks, guys. Good evening. I wanted to ask, given the international success that you've had, can you give us an update on the expansion strategy there? And any considerations of accelerating any particular regions?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Bryan, thanks for the question on that. We are building out, as you know, Germany, and we're building out Mexico at the current time. We've had actually quite a lot of success in Germany already with the actual product. We spoke about Henkel inside the stockholder letter, which was one of the largest sales we've ever done, with over 50,000 employees on a global basis.

So we're quite encouraged with that. We are obviously inquisitive to different types of Excelity types of opportunities that we believe we can acquire, migrate the tech over to the Dayforce side, continue building out the Dayforce platform to have more native countries and go from -- so as they come up, we do look at all opportunities.

Bryan Bergin -- Cowen and Company -- Analyst

OK. And then just on the wallet. On the back end, as that scales, what are you considering around the financing of that?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

So we haven't spoken too much about the actual financing at the moment other than our cost of funds is probably about 8 to 10 basis points per actual load. And we compare that to the interchange that is about 125 basis points. There's the program management fees. So that we net about 80 basis points on a particular $1 spent, so 0.8% type of profit.

As we go forward, we are looking at ways to actually structure the back end of the wallet with various types of kind of banking, if you like, avenues. And I think we'll speak a lot more about that in the second half of next year.

Bryan Bergin -- Cowen and Company -- Analyst

OK. Thank you.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

Thanks, Bryan. The next question comes from the line of Mark Marcon with Baird. Mark, go ahead, please.

Mark Marcon -- Baird -- Analyst

Hey, everybody. Thanks for taking the question. I'm wondering, can you talk a little bit more about the implementation pipeline and how you see that unfolding as this year progresses, particularly with the calendar year start-up time period? And then I have a question with regards to the clients that have put in place the on-demand payroll.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Sure. So, Mark, I think what you're asking is what is the revenue buildup into next year.

Mark Marcon -- Baird -- Analyst

That's correct.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Right. Because as you know, we do start recognizing recurring revenue when a customer goes live. Q1, we had impact in terms of sales at the very end in kind of late March. Q2, I think we saw the majority of the impact from COVID.

But as we did mention in our Q2 call, Q2 sales still came in above our Q2 sales levels in 2019. And Q3, obviously, we're back to the levels that we had expected at the beginning of the year. You have to obviously roll that forward. And typically, you can look at a six- to nine-month implementation timeline for most customers.

So in terms of revenue, the trough really was Q3 that we've just come out. You'll see a slight acceleration but still an impact from the Q2 sales into Q4. As we go into Q1, you'll start to see a little bit more acceleration. And by the second half of next year, we should be back to the previous growth rates that we saw.

Mark Marcon -- Baird -- Analyst

That's great. And then with regards to the clients that have put in place the digital wallet, the 60 that you mentioned, what sort of take-up rates are you seeing there? And what sort of changes in terms of the behavior are you seeing? And what's the feedback from the clients just in terms of like the ease of handling the requests, is the payroll department getting any additional work, or has it been fairly smooth?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

So let me just start with the bank. The way that we differentiate from the other on-demand pay vendors in the base is that there is no reconciliation for the payroll staff. So the payroll close is the same with the wallet as it is without the wallet. And as you know, we don't change the way that the customers have to fund their payroll that we act as a commercial lender to the customer.

So no change in architectural process. Second, we're seeing very good responses. If you just do a quick search, if you do a Google search for Dayforce Wallet, Facebook and then put in the word, care, you will see how many of our customers are now leading their job postings by discussing the Dayforce wallet. And if you come to insights or if you attend insights, well we have a number of videos of people who are using the wallet talking about their experience, and we also have the HR people and the payroll people also talking about their testimonies.

So we're very, very pleased with the experience that people are having from the wireless, and that was one of the reasons that we built the wallet. We saw an obvious way to improve the employee experience when it came to payments. And from our perspective, we question the construct of a pay period. To us, it seems like an antiquated construct from 1940s technology on that.

In terms of uptake, remember, we still are piloting the wallet. And so I can speak about the uptake across the pilot populations, which we're seeing somewhere between that 15% to 20% uptake rate, which is what we had expected. When we had done research in the industry, as we previously have discussed, the 20% uptick of the on-demand pay piece was what we had thought. We would see originally.

And in addition to that, once we have the pay card functionality, we believe we'll also get pickup from people who are still receiving paper checks and are kind of low-bank, unbanked type of people.

Mark Marcon -- Baird -- Analyst

Great. And then one last one, if I may. Are you seeing any sort of change in terms of competitive dynamics with regards to -- obviously, on the workforce management, Kronos is going through a lot. If we think about your key competitors, ADP and ultimate as it relates to HCM, they're both going through multiple steps, obviously, UKG having consolidated.

Any sort of change in terms of those competitive dynamics in terms of impacting your win rates?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

I think our win rates have remained quite strong. Obviously, as you pointed out, the two vendors are going through quite a lot of changes. One trying transition from a service-based organization into a software organization and the other, obviously, going through tremendous what I expect would be a tremendous merger types of challenges and a little bit of obscurity as to product strategy in market. And so we have been fortunate to be in the situation where we have a very stable product with very high customer satisfaction scores.

We can take our customers live predictably and we have obviously this continuous calculation engine, which leads into the ability to pay people immediately. And all of those have led to a very strong competitive position.

Mark Marcon -- Baird -- Analyst

Great. Thank you very much.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

Thanks, Mark. The next question comes from the line of Raimo Lenschow at Barclays. Go ahead.

Raimo Lenschow -- Barclays -- Analyst

Thanks. David, can you talk a little bit about, if you look international and look at the expansion there, obviously, like Europe is going a little bit back into kind of lockdown scenarios, etc. Help us understand a little bit what you're seeing there? And how will that potentially impact you or not potentially impact you given that you've got -- have been working virtually for quite a while already anyway?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

A lot of our global growth at the moment is really coming out of the countries where we have native payroll. And so in terms of the U.K., we're still seeing a very robust pipeline and a lot of sales activity, and we were very pleased with the traction that we got in Q3 and Q2 in the U.K. The same is true across ANZ, where we have a Dayforce native product. And as I mentioned, we're seeing a positive impact from the APJ.

We've, I believe, completed the Dayforce Connected Pay integration with the Excelity components, so I think we're OK from that perspective. Germany, we've been successful, but remember, we're not going to launch native payroll for Germany until next year. So I think we're somewhat fine from that perspective.

Raimo Lenschow -- Barclays -- Analyst

Yes. And then one follow-up. So last week, we obviously have the big HR tech conference, and you guys showed really often the CR CDAY survey in terms of customer satisfaction, etc. The one thing that was interesting though there is, they had a lot stronger customer demand in customers around more than 2,000 seed and below, actually.

I don't know if you saw that, which was slightly surprising to me. Is there some potential notion to kind of go also in that direction? Because historically, you've been more in that 3,000 to 5,000 and moving higher, but it was interesting to see the spend intent was actually very strong for you on the way down as well. Just kind of maybe some comments around that one.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Yes. Look, the product is truly differentiated in market. And it is a very big market. And remember, the whole design of the application was, can we identify batch-based workflows that shouldn't exist with today's technology? And can we solve them elegantly? And if you do that, it doesn't matter if you're a 500-employee company or 50,000-employee company, you're going to get tremendous efficiency improvements.

And those efficiency improvements, by the way, if you're a user of the system means you're taking frustration user experience of having to wait for batch-based processes or do duplicate data entry or as I mentioned, with the other on-demand pay cost, unnecessary reconciliation. For example, if you use one of our competitors' time products, it's a different pay product. You have what they call reconciliation Fridays. We don't have any of that.

So, yes, there's very strong kind of demand for a system like ours regardless of segment. For us, it really comes down to where do we get an ROI? And what the unit economics are given that we still are trying to improve EBITDA as we go forward?

Raimo Lenschow -- Barclays -- Analyst

OK. Perfect. Thank you.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

The next question comes from the line of Matthew Pfau from William Blair. Matthew, go ahead.

Matthew Pfau -- William Blair -- Analyst

Hey, guys. Thanks for taking my question. Just a quick one in terms of the competitive environment now that one of your competitors has merged. Just wondering if you've seen any change there.

Any change competitively, product-wise or perhaps in terms of sales turnover, that has impacted you guys at all?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Again, our win rates remain very strong. We believe we have a clear differentiation in terms of technology in market. In terms of that particular competitor, they still have separation of data of systems of process of use cases between time and pay. And unless you bring those together, I don't think you can deliver a modern experience to your customers and to their employees.

Matthew Pfau -- William Blair -- Analyst

Great. Thanks, guys.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

The next question comes from the line of Yao Chew at Credit Suisse. Yao, go ahead.

Yao Chew -- Credit Suisse -- Analyst

Hey, everyone. Thanks for taking my question. Again, great to see execution, and I hope everyone is staying safe. I had a question around capital allocation.

Given the success of the M&A you've done with RITEQ and Excelity, do you think this current environment opens up more potential M&A opportunities? And is this the right time to be more opportunistic, especially in areas where there's dedicated growth efforts either in enterprise or overseas?

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

That's actually a great question and thank you for asking. It's something that we debate internally all the time that we know that we have about a 3%, 4% market share in major markets and much less than that in terms of enterprise and global. And so just staying true to our current growth strategies, which, again, are acquiring new customers, going back to the custom base and selling them additional modules, moving into the enterprise space, extending it into global, where we have native payroll and we have the Excelity APJ pieces and then going into adjunct markets like the Dayforce Wallet. Just by focusing on those five avenues, we can still drive tremendous growth.

Sometimes, we do come across opportunities like Excelity or like RITEQ that allow us to accelerate our entrance into an emerging market. But for each of those, we have to look at it as to what else we have to give up because we don't have unlimited budget to build everything that we would like to do, increased sales and marketing expenses where we can get proper returns and do the necessary integration fees. And that's the discussions that we have internally over time.

Yao Chew -- Credit Suisse -- Analyst

That's great. Thank you. And if I can have a quick follow-up here. I wanted to clarify the comment on the letter around the 80 small market customer losses, each with fewer than 100 employees.

Are these all due to customers going out of business or any of them competitive losses? Is there any vertical or geographic exposure here? And how should we frame or think about this churn issue going forward? Are we past the worst of it? Is it isolated to the smaller customers? Just any guideposts there would be helpful.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Yes. So let me just give a true kind of a -- put proper box around this. This is in relation to Canadian Powerpay payroll customers who use Dayforce Workforce Management. So they are predominantly a Powerpay customer, typically with very few employees.

And because they need time and attendance capabilities, which isn't in the Powerpay product, they use to Dayforce Workforce Management. Each of those customers that we're talking about, these are the customers that were impacted most by COVID. So you're talking about the mom-and-pop shops, the very small kind of hospitality, retail outlets that simply did not survive COVID.

Yao Chew -- Credit Suisse -- Analyst

Great. Thank you very much.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

Next question comes from the line of Scott Fletcher at CIBC. Scott, go ahead.

Scott Fletcher -- CIBC -- Analyst

Hi. Sorry there. I was on mute for a second. Actually, being close to the end of the list here, I think I've had all my questions covered off.

So I'm OK. Thank you.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Thank you, Scott.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

Our Next question comes from the line of Arvind Ramnani at Piper Sandler. I apologize. Arvind is actually not on right now. The next question comes from the line of Chris Silvestre at Veritas.

Chris, go ahead.

Chris Silvestre -- Veritas Investment Research -- Analyst

Hey, everyone. Thanks. I've also got my questions covered off. Thank you.

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

We have no other questions in the queue. And that concludes the call for today. Thank you, everyone, for joining our third-quarter 2020 earnings call. Look forward to talking to you soon.

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Thanks, everyone. Have a good night.

Duration: 41 minutes

Call participants:

Jeremy Johnson -- Vice President of Finance and Investor Relations

David Ossip -- Chief Executive Officer

Alex Zukin -- RBC Capital Markets -- Analyst

Matt Coss -- J.P. Morgan -- Analyst

Siti Panigrahi -- Mizuho Securities -- Analyst

Noemie Heuland -- Chief Financial Officer

Dan Jester -- Citi -- Analyst

Michael Turrin -- Wells Fargo Securities -- Analyst

Samad Samana -- Jefferies -- Analyst

Bryan Bergin -- Cowen and Company -- Analyst

Mark Marcon -- Baird -- Analyst

Raimo Lenschow -- Barclays -- Analyst

Matthew Pfau -- William Blair -- Analyst

Yao Chew -- Credit Suisse -- Analyst

Scott Fletcher -- CIBC -- Analyst

Chris Silvestre -- Veritas Investment Research -- Analyst

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