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Expert Summit: Where Does the Market Go From Here?

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Hard as it is to believe, it has already been a year since Lehman Brothers' implosion and the stock market mayhem that followed. Last fall, Bank of America (NYSE: BAC  ) bought Merrill Lynch overnight and AIG (NYSE: AIG  ) was sent into cardiac arrest. After the dust settled in early 2009, though, expectations have steadily risen -- and taken the market with them. The S&P 500 has roared back 52% since March, with stocks such as Goldman Sachs (NYSE: GS  ) , Apple (Nasdaq: AAPL  ) , and Freeport-McMoRan (NYSE: FCX  ) rising 80% or more. However, the index still remains 35% below its October 2007 peak.

For insights on where we go from here, I interviewed four experts to see how they see things playing out for the rest of 2009 (and beyond).

Our panel includes Bob Doll, vice chairman and global chief investment officer of equities at BlackRock (NYSE: BLK  ) ; David Kelly, chief market strategist at JPMorgan Funds; Uri Landesman, head of global growth at ING Investment Management; and Bernie Schaeffer, chairman and CEO of Schaeffer Investment Research.

The good news is that every one of them is bullish. They expect the rally to continue, but not without a pullback along the way. What follows is an edited version of what they had to say:

As we enter what are traditionally the two worst months of the year, are you bullish or bearish on the stock market for the rest of the year?

Bob Doll: I'm pretty neutral, to be honest, but if you push me into a corner one way or the other, I'll lean to the bullish side. The market has run from a scenario six months ago where people thought the world might end. I think a lot of the rally has been about that view being too negative.

Have we started to bake some recovery in? We have, but the debate of course is how quick will it be, and therein will lie the pattern for the market. I think there is enough skepticism out there, enough cash on the sidelines, and enough improvement of the news that the path of least resistance remains to the upside.

Having said that, I think we'll have a bump sometime between here and the end of the year. Markets never move in a straight line and we're due for a consolidating setback.

David Kelly: The bottom line is that I'm bullish for long-term investors. I don't think that we can profitably try to time which month to get in or out of the market.

For the long term, I think that although the market is off its lows, those lows were extraordinarily low. If you believe the economy will gradually recover over the next few years, then I think there will be very good gains for stocks -- very likely double-digit annual returns on average over the next five years. So I would be overweight stocks.

Uri Landesman: If you held a gun to my head, I'm bullish, with the following caveats: My end-of-the-year target on the S&P is 1135. Now, it's possible that we'll see 900 before going to 1135. So short-term, what's going to determine this market as much as fundamentals is technicals. I think we will see somewhat of a correction over the next two months, with important support at 970, 930, and especially 900 on the way down. The next level up is 1225.

Bernie Schaeffer: We like the market's prospects from here until year-end. The "too far, too fast" mentality is one of several "fear factors" that has kept cash on the sidelines -- cash that might be deployed in the future to drive further gains and contain pullbacks.

The market will bump up against key technical areas along the way, so it won't exactly be a smooth ride higher. Pullbacks should be shallow, despite growing anxiety among many professional traders who continue to fear a sharp pullback as we move into historically weaker months.

What's the catalyst to drive us higher, or lower for that matter?

Doll: For higher, continued evidence that the economy is improving -- lower unemployment claims, slow but steady improvement in the other jobs numbers, continued improvement in leading indicators (which have been screaming higher), more signs that inventories are being rebuilt, and an uptick in business and consumer confidence.

If these all continue to improve as they have now for several months, I think the market will work its way higher. What could set us back, aside from that not coming true and the opposite, is some sort of notable credit bump. I think we'll have some credit bumps, but I think they'll be small enough generally speaking that the market will absorb it.

Kelly: What would drive us higher is just the continuation of better economic news. The problem is that it has been 27 years since we have seen a big recession, and most people don't know what an economy does after a big recession. The truth is after a recession like this, as was the case with the prior two recessions we've had like this, the economy grew by 7% on average in the first year.

No one expected that and I'm not expecting that either, but I think we could easily do 4% GDP growth over the next year. That's a lot more than people expect. So I think this gradual confirmation of close to 4% economic growth is what could power the market higher because it's beyond people's expectations.

What could cause it to go lower? There are plenty. One is oil. I'm very worried about how volatile oil markets have been ... we had a damaging asset bubble in oil in 2008. We could see a resurgence of that, which could be a good recipe for a double-dip recession.

A second thing I worry about is the consumer sector. If consumers decide to save more and more, then that could cause the expansion to stall out.

A third thing I worry about is commercial real estate. There are a lot of losses that are going to have to be taken by banks from commercial real estate loans -- both direct loans and collateralized mortgage obligations. If that affects bank lending, that could be a significant problem.

Landesman: I think confidence throughout the system will be the catalyst for the market to go higher. Confidence from the financial players -- that if they extend credit it will be repaid. Confidence from the borrowers, be they enterprise or consumer, that they've got the ability to repay those loans. Lastly, confidence that the equity that you have in your house is safe and that your job is reasonably safe. It will be gradual.

Schaeffer: Catalysts that could drive us lower are a second-half rebound that does not surface, a Fed that suddenly changes its tone and begins a parade of premature interest-rate increases, or unemployment numbers that become worse than even the darkest projections.

There are numerous catalysts that could send the market higher, which center around a long list of fears that if not realized could move cash off the sidelines and into the market and cause further short covering. In other words, if these fears prove to be invalid or not as bad as advertised, we'd expect buyers to come off the sidelines.

Earnings are still in a position to surprise to the upside, as skeptics abound about cost-cutting being the major driver these days.

Expectations for the consumer are very modest due to debt loads, higher saving rates, and unemployment trends. Yes, this could pressure consumer spending, but to the extent this fear is baked into the stock market already, the expectation bar for the consumer has been lowered, making it easier for positive surprises.

Other fears revolve around the potential for an increase in government regulations and the potential for a commercial real estate market collapse. If the impact of these factors is not as great as expected, or if they do not surface like expected, these would be other catalysts to draw cash off the sidelines and into the stock market.

Where do you think the market is headed, Fool? Let us know by leaving a comment below.

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Fool contributor Jennifer Schonberger owns shares of Bank of America, but does not own shares of any of the other companies mentioned in this article. Apple is a Stock Advisor recommendation. The Motley Fool has a disclosure policy.


Comments from our Foolish Readers

Help us keep this a respectfully Foolish area! This is a place for our readers to discuss, debate, and learn more about the Foolish investing topic you read about above. Help us keep it clean and safe. If you believe a comment is abusive or otherwise violates our Fool's Rules, please report it via the Report this Comment Report this Comment icon found on every comment.

  • Report this Comment On September 03, 2009, at 5:38 PM, TMFAleph1 wrote:

    David Kelly's forecast is much too optimistic. The odds of double-digit average stocks returns over the next five years are low (I would guesstimate they are less than one in ten), assuming we are starting from current levels. If Kelly was referring to returns starting from the market's March low, then double-digit returns over a five-year period could be achieved with dismal returns with respect to current levels.

    Alex Dumortier, CFA

  • Report this Comment On September 03, 2009, at 7:42 PM, plange01 wrote:

    with the 2nd biggest false rally in stocks now over the market is going where it did after the last in 1930....

  • Report this Comment On September 03, 2009, at 7:48 PM, charnabe wrote:

    If unemployment is nearly 10% and many more are worried about being unemployed and 2/3rds of our US economy needs the purchasing activity of the general public, then how can we see recovery anytime soon? Seems like the issue of jobs and unemployement must be taken care of before we see any real recovery. In my opinion the recovery may be much further into the future, say 2012 before we see improvement that lasts. I do agree that the market over reacted to take it down to the March lows, however we may stay around the current level for quite some time. I don't see double-digit returns within 5 years from the current market level. I see a bumpy slow ride. I do see it upward for long term.

  • Report this Comment On September 03, 2009, at 7:50 PM, ozzfan1317 wrote:

    I honestly think even now if you reinvest dividends or pick the right growth stock now is an excellent time to gain outsided returns.

  • Report this Comment On September 03, 2009, at 7:53 PM, richthegeek wrote:

    Hmmm...did any of them see the last downturn coming? Not many did as there was a fair amount of optimism floating about before the floor fell out from under all of us.

    If they didn't see it before, why should I believe them now?

    Sigh...I hate becoming a pessimist

  • Report this Comment On September 03, 2009, at 9:15 PM, smartSheep wrote:

    Unemployment was over 10% in 1982, but the DOW was already in recovery and the 80s were a great time for stocks (we racked up a lot of debt then too). Even after the rallies we've still got another 55% to go before hitting our previous high of 14000. I agree with double digit returns over the next 5 years.

  • Report this Comment On September 03, 2009, at 10:39 PM, henryking54 wrote:

    <<David Kelly's forecast is much too optimistic.>>

    David Kelly makes hundreds of thousands of dollars per year working at JP Morgan Chase.

    In contrast, you make, what, $75 per article working for a bunch of clowns?

    I'll believe David Kelly.

  • Report this Comment On September 04, 2009, at 4:36 AM, ryanalexanderson wrote:

    >> David Kelly makes hundreds of thousands of dollars per year working at JP Morgan Chase. In contrast, you make, what, $75 per article working for a bunch of clowns? I'll believe David Kelly.

    ...and it's this kind of logic that terrifies me. Would you like a list of hedge fund managers that were paid 8-figure salaries to extol the virtues of the bull market, before it crashed?

    The more money someone has riding on the need for a bull market, the less I'm inclined to believe them. Nor do I ask my barber if I need a haircut.

  • Report this Comment On September 04, 2009, at 6:02 AM, oldbear7 wrote:

    Of course market is bullish. The question is from where ?

    If recession is V shape (probably it is) we need to know where the bottom is. And nobody knows, including those with a gun on their head.

    Let say Landesman could be right. In this case wait for SP500 indice around 900 or lower!

    2010 will be another year...

  • Report this Comment On September 04, 2009, at 8:45 AM, wuff3t wrote:

    oldbear7,

    If the recovery is V-shaped we've already seen the bottom, in March. If we dip again then it'll be a W...or worse...

  • Report this Comment On September 04, 2009, at 12:33 PM, richthegeek wrote:

    Henryking54:

    On 9/19/07, Kelly - who was with Putnam Investments at the time, was quoted in an article (http://www.usatoday.com/money/markets/2007-09-18-stocks-tues... about the Fed's rate cuts as saying,

    "Rate cuts can have a meaningful impact," Kelly says. "It may very well help reduce the angst in the mortgage market." It may also expand the pool of home buyers as financing becomes more affordable, he adds.

    Though his comments were non-committal, his tone was positive. Nothing wrong with that except that that was the start of the downturn in the market - and real estate was certainly a big part of that. His big mahogany desk didn’t make his crystal ball any clearer than any one else’s. He missed it then, why would he be more accurate now?

    I have to agree with ryanalexanderson’s comment that you shouldn’t ask a barber if you need a haircut. These guys make money when people put their money in the market, not when they sideline it. By their very nature they are quick to be optimistic and much slower to say that things aren’t so rosy. We are seeing that in spades now as a good portion of the news is that the ‘recession has all but ended’ (in fact I heard that exact comment this morning on the radio coming to work).

  • Report this Comment On September 04, 2009, at 5:00 PM, Samadd wrote:

    While the market has moved much nearer a fair value, I believe there is much more upside than downside. The shape of the recovery is surely a matter of confidence which is fragile at the moment. I am with Schaeffer, if enough bad things don't happen then we are in for good returns if not necessarily double digit.

  • Report this Comment On September 05, 2009, at 2:11 AM, farifield29 wrote:

    Did not hear a word from them regarding the massive deficit Obama is creating. Unemployment is nearly 10%, there is a record number of people on food stamps, and the panel members complain that too many people might save too much rather than go max out their credit cards. The growth in the 80's came from the Reagan tax cuts. The growth in the 2000's came from the Bush tax cuts. You may not agree with their politics, but increasing taxes is always a drag on economic growth. Until sound policy is practiced (unlike cash for clunkers) there will be more instability in the markets. If another 9/11 or a series of hurricanes were to hit, the instability would be compounded.

  • Report this Comment On September 11, 2009, at 10:19 PM, RetiredSurgeon wrote:

    I must be in "Wonderland". Did'nt President Obama enter the office of President on January 22, 2009? Did'nt he inherit a 1.3 Trillion dollar deficit and two wars which were not paid for from the previous administation? These previous answers and comments sound like the Germans in 1940 blaming the Jews for everything bad in their lives when they should have been looking in the mirror to find the answers. People wont even give President Obama credit for contuing the previous Republican Administration policies, adding some of his own in rescuing the International Markets from a serious disaster.Now we are actually talking about economic recovery. I would guess the emergency is over. Let's quit blaming and complaining so much, stick to our sound investment principles, and see what happens. Maybe, just maybe, something good will happen like recovery which always happens in the end.

  • Report this Comment On October 11, 2009, at 6:23 PM, Naturebeing1 wrote:

    Newbie testing post here.

    I like the idea of buying the pullbacks. Seems like there is still money on the sidelines...........but, for how long? The market will tell us.

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