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Why You Shouldn't Listen to Jim Cramer

Whatever money you may need for the next five years, please take it out of the stock market right now, this week. I do not believe that you should risk those assets in the stock market right now."
-- Jim Cramer, Oct. 6, 2008, S&P 500 at 1,056.89.

Nearly 11 months ago and thanks in no small part to the statement above, I concluded that Jim Cramer was a menace to investors.

It only took a few months for the rest of the nation to catch on. John Stewart finally jumped on the bandwagon in March, exposing the man for what I think he really is: an entertaining (if not, irritating) media personality, but certainly not the champion of the individual shareholder that he often claims to be.

In fact, I consider him to be the closest thing to a walking, talking hazard for the individual investor there is. Now John Stewart may have the jokes, but I have the real reasons why he is precisely that and why you should take a pass on any investment advice he tries to give you.

Thank you, John Stewart!
I continue to fully applaud Cramer's stated goal -- help people make money by investing in the stock market. But Cramer's outburst in October was a mistake—plain and simple. And, as Mr. Stewart so kindly illustrated, it wasn't his first time.

You see, when someone issues panic-inducing market calls (as Cramer does from time to time) – and urges investors to avoid long-term strategies to buy and hold good companies – the average investor simply gets crushed.

Cramer's Today show plea was grounded in a sound reality: Fools should never have money they need during the next five years in the market. But by advising people to indiscriminately sell, he helps contribute to exactly the thing that he's trying to avoid: investors losing money.

Chances are, when the market was taking a chainsaw to some of our more closely held assumptions about the US financial system, most viewers were so petrified that even a very small push was likely to convince investors to join the terrified herds pulling their money out of the market. And pull they did.

Between October and the end of November, investors pulled out a whopping $140 billion from U.S. equity funds. Based on what these funds were holding, they were indirectly pulling out of mutual fund mainstays like Waste Management (NYSE: WM  ) , JP Morgan (NYSE: JPM  ) , Halliburton (NYSE: HAL  ) , Yum! Brands (NYSE: YUM  ) , Yahoo! (Nasdaq: YHOO  ) , and Texas Instruments (NYSE: TXN  ) -- many of which had already been hammered.

With the market still priced just a bit below his October "call," Cramer might've saved people some money in the very short term—and I'm pleased for that. But in order to complete the circle, he would have had to tell these people precisely when to get back in.

Where the heck was he on March 6, when we reached the most recent market low? He was nowhere to be seen on national television. Those people who were convinced to run for the hills just missed out on one of the biggest market rallies ever -- that no one saw coming. No matter how good his first call was, that's 50% he won't be able to give you back. And therefore, it was a mistake.

Instead of holding onto the steady blue-chip stocks that have historically provided investors with some of the strongest long-term returns, many investors were just progressively selling at historic lows ... thereby ignoring the sound and sage advice from names like Buffett, Lynch, Graham, Munger, and Bogle. That's the larger point.

You don't need a weatherman ...
I'll admit that Cramer is entertaining, but no one can consistently forecast the direction of the market as he pretends to be able to do. I repeat: No one can consistently forecast the direction of the market. That is the point.

It moves completely randomly and unpredictably over the short-term -- and therefore trying to make a "call" on the market won't consistently work out for you. Pick a direction (up or down), and there's a 50% chance of being right -- even though the prediction is rather meaningless.

It's like Punxsutawney Phil. The furry little critter climbs out of his hole and either sees his shadow or he doesn't. Whichever it is, the result has nothing to do with whether winter is over -- just like a stock market prediction has nothing to do with the market's movements.

The scary part is that Cramer flip-flopped numerous times in 2008, trying to call the bottom at various points throughout the year. While CNBC may gloss over this fact, I've taken careful notice. Don't forget about his theory that 2008 would be the year of natural gas. Ouch.

The talking heads on TV get paid to put on a song-and-dance show and attract viewers. It's entertainment, folks. Your education or your personal success, as John Stewart as kindly brought to light, is a secondary priority (or not a consideration at all). Following the advice of those that say they can predict the markets is likely to cost you thousands (if not more).

In the real world, there are commission costs, taxes, and opportunity costs -- all of which have a tremendous impact on the returns that you're likely to experience.

Every time you pull the trigger in your account, think about your broker and the tax-man doing a little touchdown dance. Much of their income is predicated on you transacting as much as possible.

Take a hint from someone who knows a lot about the hidden costs of investing: John Bogle, the founder of Vanguard Investments. He writes: "No matter how efficient or inefficient markets may be, the returns earned by investors as a group must fall short of the market returns by precisely the amount of the aggregate costs they incur. It is the central fact of investing."

Think about that the next time you hear "Buy, Buy, Buy" or "Sell, Sell, Sell."

And for those who listened to Mr. Cramer on his "prescient" October market call to sell, don't forget that he probably didn't bang on the table loud enough to get you back in on the 50% rally we've just had. Hopefully, you got yourself back in.

The Foolish bottom line
If you want to make money in the stock market, you need to tune out the panic -- or the euphoria. You need to remember that no one has any idea where the market is going in the near or medium term. You need to buy shares of great, built-to-last businesses. You need to hold for the long term. And you need to keep as much money as you can from the tax man or your broker.

That's what we do at Motley Fool Stock Advisor, and it's paying off. Take two of our best stocks, Marvel Entertainment and Gamestop (NYSE: GME  ) . We recommended buying shares of these stocks more than 5 years ago. Both have thrashed the market by incredible margins. Had Disney not purchased Marvel just this week, I bet we would have continued to hold it, along with Gamestop, for a long time to come.

What was the cost of doing all this? Probably $24 in broker fees and $0 in taxes. That's a perfect example of what I'm talking about. In fact, our whole scorecard is beating the S&P 500 by 43 percentage points.

As for Cramer ... he undoubtedly has an uncanny knowledge of tickers, prices, and strange catch-phrases. But what he sorely lacks -- and what you must never forget in your investing days -- is temperament. It was Warren Buffett who once said that "the most important quality for an investor is temperament, not intellect."

Want to see what else we've recommended and what we're recommending now? Click here to get a free, 30-day trial to Stock Advisor -- there's no obligation to subscribe.

Already subscribe to Stock Advisor? Log in at the top of this page.

This article was originally published Oct. 23, 2008. It has been updated.

Nick Kapur owns shares of Disney. Disney, Marvel and Gamestop are Motley Fool Stock Advisor selections. Disney is also an Inside Value recommendation. The Motley Fool's disclosure policy would never suggest it could predict or time the market.

Read/Post Comments (73) | Recommend This Article (76)

Comments from our Foolish Readers

Help us keep this a respectfully Foolish area! This is a place for our readers to discuss, debate, and learn more about the Foolish investing topic you read about above. Help us keep it clean and safe. If you believe a comment is abusive or otherwise violates our Fool's Rules, please report it via the Report this Comment Report this Comment icon found on every comment.

  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 10:22 AM, always2009 wrote:

    Great article and I could not agree more. I remember him as a tub-thumper to push sure thing stocks in the past. I lost a ton of money on JDS Uniphase because he was touting it and selling. He is still doing it.

  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 10:37 AM, NOTvuffett wrote:

    I am sick of this article. Cramer is right, if you need the money, can't wait on it, then the stock market isn't the place to have your money. Of course saying "sell, sell, sell" in October wasn't the best thing to do with the benefit of hindsight. Who knows? Many are calling this a false rally. What if it is as bad as the depression or Japan's lost decade?

  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 11:47 AM, greedwhenfearful wrote:

    Cramer's call in October was a good one and he DID tell people to get in pretty close to the bottom. Not exactly on March 6, but he pushed getting into stocks after that all the way through one of the best bull runs in history.

    Jim Cramer has given me some great investment strategies that the Motley Fool has not. In fact, my two favorite investment books are "Jim Cramer’s: Stay Mad For Life" and the Motley Fool's "Million Dollar Portfolio." Though Jim Cramer has some philosophies I strongly disagree with (like that stocks are just pieces of paper and not ownership in the company. I'm with Warren Buffet on this one), he gives a LOT of great advice. Like he says, his show is just a toolbox. The Motley Fool is just a toolbox. The "Intelligent Investor" is another toolbox. Real Fools use any tool at their disposal and make their own decisions. If I was just listening to Cramer and The Motley Fool I wouldn't have picked up Ford for just over $1. Buffet's strategies in the past lead me to that. Both Cramer and Buffet got me into WFC. Cramer taught me that 50% of a stock movement is because of its sector, and that sector diversification is crucial to a great portfolio. "There's always a bull market somewhere" is great advice for someone that though the past decade was flat. Not if you owned AAPL, GOOG, MVL, NFLX, etc.

    Though I agree that Cramer can be reckless, his good advice greatly outweighs his bad advice. His show isn't enough for judgment (though he has been improving it lately by covering more items from his books). You really need to read all of his books to make a true judgment. Fool on!


  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 12:46 PM, rickey32162 wrote:

    Cramer does not know all but, he knows more than most.

    He made a great sell call in October. He was crucified for it. You can't seriously believe that he can move the market like that and take down Lehman Brothers, Merrill Lynch, etc.

    He has been banging on the table to buy for many months from the low.

    As for Bogel's buy and hold philosophy, over the last 10 years the S&P index is flat.

    Vanguard's buy and hold funds S&P Index, Growth and Income, Growth Equity, and Growth Index have had negative 10 yr average returns of -.86%, -1.07%, - 3.89% and -2.30%.

    I don't think the average investor would be happy with those returns.

  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 1:46 PM, atho1955 wrote:

    The reality is this: it is few, if any, individuals who should actually own individual stocks. A solid mutual fund is one thing, and it's called 'investing'. Unless you can afford to own a well-rounded, diverse portfolio of individual stocks (read: self-created mutual fund), then investing in individual stocks is not truly investing, it is more akin to speculating. Good for me that I had the 'wisdom' to purchase Apple Computer at $88 per share three years ago as well as Starbucks at $15 per share fifteen years ago. (I've since sold both at a tidy profit!) But it was not truly 'wisdom' as much as blind luck in recognizing the fad mentality of the general public's tastes.

    It appears that the same 'fad mentality' colors Mr. Cramer's and his followers' investment practices.

  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 2:10 PM, ccerenz wrote:

    I have to laugh when I read articles like this. Here's a guy that puts his opinion in public view 5 nights a week. He does it to try to help people, and people like this author do nothing but try to hammer the guy for their own gain.

    Quick, name any other person who called the 2000 tech bubble, the 2003 low, the real estate turnaround almost to a day, made that great call last September, and then, called the bottom in early March. There is only one. His name is JIM CRAMER!!!! Nothing you can write or say can change these facts.

    One has to ask the tough question, why do people like this author try to tear the man down, when he is so good at what he does? It's an interesting question, buried somewhere in human psychology.

    You can't rewirte history here. The man is golden with his big trend calls. Get over it.

  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 2:12 PM, pwhitten wrote:

    So you think Jim Cramer is a menace to investors? And your opinion is solid because of comments from John Stewart? What credentials does Stewart have relating to investing?

    I really liked what destroyevidence said, that Cramer's shows and books are tools, just as the Fool is another tool. Real Fools use any tool at their disposal and make their own decisions.

    As for Cramer flip-flopping, if you watched his show, you would know that this is one his underlying lessons for investors. If you do your homework, you would know that changing market conditions may lead to a re-evaluation of positions on a certain stock or sector. This, to me, is one argument against LTBH.

    Sure, he has some faults. I don't recall him ever discussing the underlying costs of investing. But that's why I also am learning from the Fool.

    After all, the mission of both the Fool and Cramer is to educate, amuse and enrich. I'll stick to Cramer AND the Fool.


  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 2:20 PM, danteps wrote:

    Nice work ccernz on exaggerting the good calls and omitting the bad calls.

    Cramer is nothing special and doesn't care about people. He has a giant ego and cares about ratings. If he didn't, why the over-the-top Lightning Round? Why all of the yelling and screaming, the gimmicks, the sound effects, etc. People are sheep, if this is your shepherd, good luck.

    Investing isn't about buy, buy, buy . . . sell, sell, sell. Only the rarest of folks will achieve above average returns using this mentality (assuming Cramer is right, which occurs about 50% of the time, flip the coin). Trading costs and taxes will destroy your returns. These expenses must be noted and captured.

  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 2:28 PM, kamuirei wrote:

    "I am sick of this article."


    "Nice work ccernz on exaggerting the good calls and omitting the bad calls. "

    The same can be said of the Fool. Remember that ticker that showed the performance of ALL their letters? Where is it?

  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 2:53 PM, FreeTruth wrote:

    How could you republish this and still get "Jon" Stewart's name wrong? Come on, you're paid to write and others pay to read this stuff. I'm not a fan of either of those guys.

  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 3:03 PM, LngTrmVw wrote:

    the main reason not to listen is because he's an admitted market manipulator. You may forgive his selfish and unethical behavior because we all have our foibles, but in this case his foibles actually make it more difficult for all the fair minded and law abiding investors to achieve their financial goals. He has a lot of deep knowledge of markets and investing and tries to show some of that to his viewers, but it is for no other reason than to build viewers. His overall approach is to step on the very people he claims to try to be helping.

  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 3:13 PM, Fool wrote:

    You are an idiot, Jim did make a near bottom call and has told investors to move back in. Some time ago I might add. NOw everything out of his mouth is not golden, however he is entertaining and insightful with his perspective on investing and wall street. What I tire of hearing is the pundent who are constantly wrong, that parade on fox and cnbc


  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 5:22 PM, naturallyskeptic wrote:

    Reading the posts supporting Cramer reminds me of religious zealots supporting irrational beliefs. Those who believe in him will believe, regardless of the facts. The man has shown time and time again, including in a book written by a former employee, that he is not to be trusted and has a flawed ethical compass. His advice is no more helpful than a Ouija board. Best of luck to those of you who follow him.

  • Report this Comment On September 06, 2009, at 9:13 PM, iamp20 wrote:

    Should you trust jim Cramer? 2 words:

    Len Dijkstra.

    The guy has good ideas. Worth listening to, the same as any other talking head on wall street. If you take his words as buy/sell signals, then you truly are a fool. and not the motley kind

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 12:18 AM, brpcaps wrote:

    Actually, I agree some of the views of the author and some not. I like some of Cramer's ideas (like why you should invest independent of so called analysts and why profit booking is must). At the same time, I always don't care about Cramer's stock recommendations and timing.

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 2:12 AM, ccerenz wrote:

    I could care less about Jim Cramer's antics, his lightning round, his ego, a disgruntled former employee, or what channel he's on. The only thing that matters to me is his performance. That, in the end, is THE factor that helps my portfolio.

    Again, I have to wonder, what part of human psychology compels the negative emotional response

    that comes from so many who can only wish to be as accurate as Cramer has been on the big trends?

    danteps wrote "nice job on exaggerating the good calls, and omitting the bad calls"... So let's look at the facts.

    I said he made the call on tech in 2000. Did he or didn't he. He did. No exaggeration there.

    He called the bottom in 2003. Didn't he or did he. He did. No exaggeration there.

    He called the coming calamity in Sept 08. Didn't he or did he. He did. No exaggeration there. A gutsy call to be made on national TV like that.

    He made the call in early March and told everyone who watched his show to start getting back in. Did he or didn't he. He did. Still no exaggeration. Just the facts. Again, gutsy call that few others besides Doug Kass were making.

    Jim repeated the call to stay in through most of April, May, June, July, and August. During that time, he also mentioned that he thought the market may pull back from time to time, but he followed that up by saying the pullbacks would be relatively shallow and to buy them. Right again.

    So where is the exaggeration danteps? Those are bankable calls. Show me any other pundit who did that.

    And was he right or wrong on real estate? So far, he's looking darn near exact to the day. Only time will tell if the market turns back down. But right now, it turned up this summer, which he called last fall. Can you name one person who got that right besides Jim Cramer? Maybe there's a good reason the guy has a big ego. (if he does)

    It's not like I'm in love with the guy, but credit has to be given where it is earned. And for some reason, folks see his antics as an easy target....and that's not right.

    Now, what did I omit? Yeah, he's made losing calls on many stocks. I frankly don't care. Because I don't make any investment until I've done my own work. If anyone here does invest based upon someone else's recommendation only, then please step away from the computer and go find a good professional adviser to help you...or pay the subscription to Motley Fool as they have a good rep also...but I'm not sure articles like this creates the image the Fool is after.

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 2:17 AM, portefeuille wrote:

    Now, what did I omit?


    the bad ones.

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 2:29 AM, ccerenz wrote:

    Portefeuille wrote:

    "...the bad ones"

    Name the bad ones.

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 8:59 AM, navarrejeff wrote:

    People so often trust tv personalities just because they have there own show,, Did you know that the original funding for Jim Krammers show was from a company that he owns??? Is'nt that ironic,, go figure ,, personally I cant stand the loud mouth sob ,, because I know him for exactly what he is ,,He should take his place behind a game at a carnival,, you know those people that hawk you in for a buck,, Go join the side show mr krammer, thats where you belong

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 9:08 AM, navarrejeff wrote:

    My diffenition of jim krammer , he is equal to foolsgold,, dont you think that the stocks that he reccommends on one day he already bought 3 days before ,,????????????? food for thought,, do your own research and YOU are in control,, as its the way it should be ,,

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 11:12 AM, ccerenz wrote:


    You paint with a broad brush. While your comments have lots of color, you provide nothing in terms of facts to support your position.

    The way I see it,every reporter looking for a big break would love to bring Cramer down. Thus, my bet is that he has been investigated, followed, phone tapped, and imposed upon in every way, in hopes that some snoop could dig up some dirt to bring him down. Your unsupported conjecture that he buys 3 days before has no element of fact, but simply demonstrates your fear that he may be doing something like that. And again, no one should be making investments based upon any recommendation from anyone. It should only be considered a starting point to do your own analysis. By the way, Cramer goes through this ad nauseum on his show. Do your homework.

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 11:18 AM, migunnemsae wrote:

    "Whatever money you may need for the next five years, please take it out of the stock market right now, this week. I do not believe that you should risk those assets in the stock market right now."

    Inciting panic is certainly the wrong thing to do, but this is very sound advice nonetheless. Whatever money you are certain you will need in the next five years, whether it's a down payment on a house or living expenses, it should never be invested in something as volatile and arbitrary as the stock market. In the short term, stock values are subject to the whim of emotional and overreactionary investors. In fact, this has been part of the Motley Fool's mantra since its humble beginnings: put the money you'll need in the next five to ten years in a safe place, like an FDIC-insured money market account or CDs.

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 12:02 PM, luckyspike01 wrote:

    It's obvious the author does not actually watch Cramer's show based on his comments. Certainly he has not read his books. I don't know why the man shares as much as he does with the world, but I take it with a grain of salt, do my homework, and make my own decisions.

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 3:14 PM, rbw1226 wrote:

    Bottom line is anyone investing should do their homework. But sadly most don't have a clue and invest blindly taking the word of their advisors, friends, co-workers, tv, and even message boards. Most of them could do just as well throwing darts at the financial section of the newspaper.

    Timing market entries and exits is beyond most of them, because for decades they have been taught the buy-and-hold approach. But now with the web having so much info for free we may just see more educated investors in the coming decades.

    I was able to know enough to protect and have an 18% gain in our 401k plans for 2008. And I did so without Jim or fool. So it can be done with homework, timing, and money.

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 10:24 PM, rlm3156 wrote:

    ANYBODY who does as Cramer says to do is what you must call the GREATER FOOL. I watch Mad Money for laughs and entertainment. It can be quite amusing and he has made a few no brainer calls but besides that his advice is absurd.He basically tries to get people to buy his book the whole show.

    My favorite episode was when a guy called in, stated his name, where he was from, then told Cramer he owns a six figure portfolio and was wondering what to do with it.He asked Cramer where and what he should do with his money because of the market being so volatile.WOW.You would think if one has a six figure portfolio he would have some type of market or investing knowledge.But no, its guys like Cramer who scare people into thinking only he knows what is best for their money that they previously invested based on their for some people, it really does man.

  • Report this Comment On September 07, 2009, at 11:53 PM, stocksup2 wrote:

    If Cramer is so brilliant, than why did he wait until the Dow was at 9,000 to tell people to get out instead of when the Dow peaked at over 14,000? Investors would have been able to save almost 40% between these two points. He went on that rant about the Fed not knowing anything, but he was still telling investors to buy. When the market is going straight up for a long period of time, that is when you need to start telling investors to become cautious, not after the market has tanked 40%. To sum it in the words of a truly great investor, Warren Buffet, "Be greedy when others are fearful, and be fearful when others are greedy."

    If Cramer did so well at his hedge fund, how come he still doesn't work for Goldman Sachs? How come he just doesn't trade stocks with his own money if his picks are so great? That is because he can make so much money by duping people into believing that he knows as much as he does so that he can sell his books and get subscriptions to his website. Yeah, he tells people to do their homework, but that is only to save his butt and because he knows that most people won't. Most investors are either too lazy to do their own work or they just chase the next hot thing because they want to become rich over night. Instead of buying low and selling high, they chase when the market goes up and panic when the market goes down.

    As for calling the housing bottom, prices are still dropping here in Florida, and it is 3 months later than his so-called bottom. This goes with California and Nevada, as well. How about 2008 being the year of natural gas? How is that call looking?

    How about some of his segments. There was one where he would go through stocks that were going to $120. I remember Boeing and Conoco Phillips being two of those. They now sit at about $50 and $45, respectively.

    People like him are only out for themselves. They always make sure to tell you when they are right, but fail miserably to mention when their advice is wrong.

  • Report this Comment On September 08, 2009, at 12:16 AM, danteps wrote:

    Here are some of the bad calls that may or may not have been omitted, feel free to add.

    Cramer is an entertainer He has caused significant finanical losses for thousands of people. Please be careful.

    11th March 2008 - Bear Stearns is fine, do not take your money out, BEAR STERNS is fine, Do not move your money out of Bear Stearns, Don't be Silly (ALL with the backdrop of the Bear Stearns Stock price)

    6 Days Later - Bear Stearns Loses 90% of its value, and Jim Cramer attempts to revise history about what he implied on the 11th, but the video does NOT lie. HIS STOCK PICKING CNBC SHOW, WHILST REFERRING TO THE BEAR STEARN'S STOCK PRICE TOLD INVESTORS TO STAY PUT!

    13th June 2008 - Jim Cramer's bull market buy calls - Says buy Banks, Buy Brokers, Wells Fargo, JP Morgan and tech stocks, and home builders, retailers.

    Says NOT to buy oil and gas.

    20th June 2008 - Jim revises history, he says - If you own banks and retailers then you are like the golam, not listening to him. He says if you own banks, home builders and retailers then you will be in pain, despite the fact that he specifically recommended buying bank stocks and retailers a week earlier.

    Now he says the most important sector he recommends that you should have bought is oil and natural gas, whilst forgetting that the previous week he said NOT to buy them !

    Jim's Bad Call - Housing Stocks Bottom called 2006

    Jim's Bad Call - Fantastic U.S. Economy During 2008 - Feb 2007

    Jim's Bad Call - Buy the Dow at 14,000 Bull Market Calls - November 2007

    Jim's Bad Call - Buy Retail Stocks - November 2007

    Jim's Bad Call - Buy the Bank Stocks - Feb 2008

    Jim's Bad Call - Dow 13,800 - Buy the stock maket again

    Jim's Bad Call - Dow 12,300 - Dow Falls but Cramer says Buy, Buy, Buy ! Expects a HUGE rally

    Jim's Bad Call - Dendreon. Sell, Sell, Sell before the June 2007 FDA Advisory panel (the panel gave them a favorable review)

    That should suffice for now. To be fair, Cramer is right some of the time as well. It's just hard to seperate the wheat from the shaft.

  • Report this Comment On September 08, 2009, at 8:48 AM, devandev wrote:

    Why is this article continuously posted on MF? (Don't let the date at the top fool you; I've seen it I don't know how many times in the past 6 months.) Why this constant denigrating of Jim Cramer? Is it because he's popular and people listen to him? So are lots of other market commentators who also make market calls and stock picks. MF's crusade against one successful TV personality is getting very, very old. Get a life. It's hard to take you seriously when your article ends with an ad for your own stock picking (pay) service. I won't be renewing my subscription.

  • Report this Comment On September 08, 2009, at 10:48 AM, rctlip1 wrote:

    X'cuse me Gents- JC has admitted on TV -

    and Press that the talked up Stock he owned and then dumped-a Friend of the common Investor ? I think not .

  • Report this Comment On September 08, 2009, at 11:00 AM, ChannelDunlap wrote:

    Once I stopped just reading about him here and watched him on his show, he's actually not such a bad guy. he does give some pretty decent advice, and his calls on specific companies can be interesting if only to hear his reason WHY and then apply it to other stocks.

    Seriously, TMF Bashes Cramer far more than he deserves. He made a lot of really bad calls pre-crash (A bunch that Stewart publicized on his show to great humerous effect), but I have to say, this rally he's done pretty good. Said to bail in October, said to buy again in March... good luck finding any other analyst who made both calls.

  • Report this Comment On September 08, 2009, at 3:21 PM, yankeefaninmd wrote:

    you're an idiot. Cramer's call was dead on. If you got out when he said, then back in when he called the bottom, you made big $$$$$

    check your facts

  • Report this Comment On September 08, 2009, at 4:53 PM, dividendgrowth wrote:

    Cramer's call on Oct 6 was perfect.

    If you want to bash Cramer, pick at least one of his many bad market calls.

  • Report this Comment On September 08, 2009, at 6:12 PM, ToddK1 wrote:

    Just for fun, let's watch Jon Stewart destroy Jim Cramer all over again...

    Cramer routinely deceives and manipulates regulators, financial journalists, and the public. The only question left is why does he still have a job on CNBC recommending stocks?

  • Report this Comment On September 09, 2009, at 1:52 AM, justinm11 wrote:

    Same here, devandev. I've read this article for the last time. Listen, Fool, I understand that you have to promote your service and you do so in a great way - by providing free articles with valuable information. But the Cramer obsession is getting a little ridiculous and, frankly, is telling. Whether it's the New York Yankees, the United States of America, or Fox News, those who are the continued subject of criticism from rivals are usually those at the top of their game. With that in mind, Motley Fool continues to provide a ringing endorsement for Jim Cramer by publishing this same article every couple of months. I signed up here as a new investor and purchased Stock Advisor and have generally been happy with it. But this type of advertising doesn't exactly scream confidence.

  • Report this Comment On September 09, 2009, at 11:53 AM, plange01 wrote:

    cramer like everyone else has some good need to watch what you listen to because he has a lot of personal agenda's he promotes.

  • Report this Comment On September 09, 2009, at 2:04 PM, Superdrol wrote:

    Cramer is the worst financial analyst ever. He gets paid to run his gums period. If he actually were successful as a hedge fund manager, he'd have stayed doing that. Let's face it, we go where the cash is.

    He is entertaining and sells a story to the average investor who isn't too bright. On the upside though, I was on the other end picking up a lot of stocks being thrown overboard.

  • Report this Comment On September 09, 2009, at 3:03 PM, MasonGibbs wrote:

    Cramer has offered good advice in his books and his team of professional stock advisors are well educated. Nobody in any business is going to win friends by pointing fingers. Cramer explained in his books what to do win you see a major downslide which is to get out. It isn't for everyone. He had experienced many big losses in trading an learned to cut these losses and rebuild. It you had limited money and were investing it was a good decision to get out in October. If you had enough money to live on for a couple of years and could suffer for a that long then holding on for dear life was a good move. Really, nobody new how bloody this downside was. He could not stomach it so it was wise for him.

  • Report this Comment On September 09, 2009, at 3:28 PM, MasonGibbs wrote:

    Can we rate articles on this website?

    On a scale of 1-10 with 1 being the worst what do you think the comments reflect about this article? Was this article in jest only or to make fun of others? I have read some articles in the past from people at this site and they have been amusing but not really what I was looking for. Is this a serious site now? Is is for comedians like John Stewart so they can get material. I don't know where your head is at. I tried reading something serious on this site about stocks and it was like an empty catagory on growth stocks. What is going on here? Help?

  • Report this Comment On September 09, 2009, at 10:56 PM, ValuePEG wrote:

    I refuse to watch Jim Cramer simply because he issues advice on stocks that he simply doesn't follow, follow closely, or simply doesn't understand. Intelligent stock advice cannot be achieved by looking at a stock for 15 minutes or less (day traders be damned, sorry). If he was to ONLY give generalizations on market or only give advice on stocks he closely followed his show might be worthwhile, but when he repeatedly makes unabashed comments on stocks he has barely heard of he is dangerous to the unwitting public. Here is a stock that he simply didn't understand - updating that post Jim did state he favored that stock on 5/14/09 after it more than doubled from his Sell-Sell-Sell recommendation.

  • Report this Comment On September 10, 2009, at 12:30 AM, Tacomatight wrote:

    "Cramer is the worst financial analyst ever. He gets paid to run his gums period. If he actually were successful as a hedge fund manager, he'd have stayed doing that. Let's face it, we go where the cash is."

    Most of what I wanted to say was covered above. I saw a few comments about his hedge fund days that need correction. He was a very successful hedge fund manager for over 10 years. He ended his career after the stress became too much which is not suprising as a hedge fund manager must be one of the most stressful jobs in the world.

    He does manage a large portfolio for his charity that does very well. His overall record is not in question, he's very good at what he does, both as a fund manager and as a TV personality.

    His books are very valuable for the non-professional trader, which I am. As said above, all stock advise is part of your "tool box," to build a successful portfolio.

    It is your responsibility to research and choose the stocks which best fit your situation and risk tolerance.

    His constant hammering to buy (which I have) since March, was absoultely right on and has allowed me to get gains that would take years in a normal market. When comparing his performance in the advise arena over the last 6 months, to most other analysts I follow, he is best of breed.

    Most of the vitriol thrown at Mr. Cramer on this site is due to the fact that he is a bull, while a large portion of the writers and bloggers on this site are bears. The bears have lost handidly and they don't want to admit it. I wouldn't either if the roles were reversed.

    In closing, I subscribe to two of his services, Action Alert Plus and Real Money. When coupled with the MF and my ETRADE account research, I am able to make educated and very often exciting buys in the market.

  • Report this Comment On September 10, 2009, at 1:09 AM, HarryCaraysGhost wrote:

    The MF could take him out.

    Just do the exact opposite of Cramer.

  • Report this Comment On September 10, 2009, at 8:59 AM, Bobwiley985 wrote:

    His name is Jim cramer, not GOD. there for he is human and a Broker by trade..I've done better with Jim Cramer than my broker back in the DOT com days, who acted like Kevin Bacon in Animal House.. " All is well, do not panic" when I called him and voiced my conserns to sell, I messed up and took his advice and now I'm still Upside down on a lot of Tec stocks. MY broker has since been fired and replaced.

  • Report this Comment On September 10, 2009, at 9:43 AM, ccerenz wrote:


    I watched the show where the lady called in about Bear Stearns. She asked if her money was safe with Bear my account safe? Not, is my investment in Bear Stearns shares safe. Again, you and the other 'experts' don't know what you are talking about.

    And by the way, my seven figure portfolio is UP over the past year. And a little of it has to do with Jim Cramer's call in the fall of last year, and his call in March of this year.

    This article is factually incorrect. Check out the details before you spout off.

  • Report this Comment On September 10, 2009, at 10:03 AM, ccerenz wrote:


    As I read through your list of bad calls. I can't argue each because I don't recall the detail. But the two I know about, the call he did make in March of this year to get back in, and the Bear Stearns call are both inaccurate. So, while I can't refute the others, nor do I want to, their accuracy is completely up for grabs.

    It seems to me that if Motley wants to expand it's subscriber base, it would want to focus on it's own achievements versus try to tear down the competition. This is especially so since the article is factually inaccurate.

    And yes, I'll subscribe in a heart beat if you can show me how all the bullish calls the Fool made before September 2008 worked out.

  • Report this Comment On September 10, 2009, at 12:47 PM, GoOtto4Nic8 wrote:

    Jim Cramer was a successful hedge fund manager, but remember that this was back in the day when we didn't have Reg FD. He made plenty of money with inside information, and he manipulated stocks, up or down, whenever he needed to. Obviously he's a smart guy, but let's not attribute all of his returns to investing acumen, when at least some of it was stock manipulation.

    He's made good and bad calls, just like everybody else. But if you're doing your own investing, you have to be able to accurately weigh his information just like any other input variable. The people that follow him probably do move many stocks. As an individual investor, you can either curse that, or accept it as reality. Whether you love him or hate him, getting worked up about it probably isn't going to help.

  • Report this Comment On September 10, 2009, at 1:05 PM, mikecart1 wrote:

    This article blows. Not because it hates on Jim Cramer - who's bank account craps on the entire staff here at TMF, but because it is just one big hyprocritical story.

    "You need to buy shares of great, built-to-last businesses. You need to hold for the long term. And you need to keep as much money as you can from the tax man or your broker. "

    1) I don't need to buy built-to-last businesses.

    2) I don't need to hold for any long-term.

    3) Tax man?

    I saw later that Warren Buffet was mentioned in a quote. This article is a joke. Basically it is saying 'stay away from spec plays that might make you a lot of money if you do your research and invest wisely with stop sells in place', 'hold every stock you have for long-term no matter how little it moves', and 'make sure you worry about those taxes on the little returnes you will make from holding those stable stocks'.

    TMF 0

    Cramer 1

  • Report this Comment On September 10, 2009, at 1:10 PM, mikecart1 wrote:

    Also to the posters above, you only have 3 options here:

    1) Hate Cramer, but also hate TMF

    2) Like Cramer, but also hate TMF

    3) Like Cramer, like TMF

    Basically when a site produces SIRI articles daily, has their focus on like 0.01% of the market, and who's pride and joy is only beating the S&P by 40%+ for the year, you can't really say TMF is any better than Cramer.

    At least Jim Cramer discusses different stocks everyday. I come on here and I see the same topics talking about the same group of stocks - over and over again.

  • Report this Comment On September 10, 2009, at 7:03 PM, SOBER38YEARS wrote:


  • Report this Comment On September 11, 2009, at 5:46 AM, RussMillennium wrote:

    This SITE IS A NONSENSE...only produced to make money...yeah you are similar to Cramer and Wall Street...and your opinions are nonsense...really

    Your non or bad call on Financials like BAC and Citigroup are worst than Cramers...

    See the opinions of Dick Bove or Meredith Whitney

  • Report this Comment On September 11, 2009, at 1:56 PM, VegasMartin wrote:

    Perhaps Cramer introduced more fear into the market and spurred more panic selling, but he's call was the right one. The market was headed lower, so if you need money in the next couple months, convert it into cash now so you stop losing money. AND he actually did call the bottom. When the Dow was 6,500 he said there's no room for it to go lower. He did call the bottom. He also predicted the turn in the housing market in June 2009, which he forecasted in 2008. Jim may change his mind a lot and may pick some losers, but he knows his stuff and is a great educator as well as entertainer.

  • Report this Comment On September 11, 2009, at 5:14 PM, thementalist wrote:

    I have to agree that Cramer is ridiculus on TV, however I use his Real Money silver service and have received a lot of good tips from some of the contributors. I also can say that while Cramer has his faults, I do owe him a level of gratitude for directing me towards KBR at $10.00. The real secret is to use your own screening, but in this case I was directed towards a real gem, with lots of cash, large government contracts and no debt, that I did not even think about until I heard it from him. Blind stock picks are one thing, but informed purchases that you research after getting the intial "tip" can simply point you in a good direction.

  • Report this Comment On September 11, 2009, at 5:22 PM, Motherlode1 wrote:

    I concur with all those above who posted comments in support of Jim Cramer and 'Mad Money'. I am a close follower of Jim and just extended my subscription to his premium Real Money Silver service. With this service I have ready access to many of the brightest investment minds in the world: Jim Cramer, Doug Kass, James 'Rev Shark' DePore, Dick Arms, Helene Meisler, Tim Melvin, Ron Insana, Etc.Etc. I get the benefit of their comments and investment suggestions daily. I also get full insight into Jim's Action Alerts Plus portfolio that he maintains for his charitable trust. I get emails from Jim / AAP announcing every trade he makes, with a full explanation of the trade, BEFORE, he makes the trade. I get his weekly roundup for AAP with his ranking of each of his portfolio positions He 'walks the talk'. I do not follow every suggestion Jim makes, but I do weigh his and the suggestions of the other RMS contributors heavily in my market analysis / stock picking / investment deciscions. I recommend that you all do as I have done: Subscribe to RMS on and cancel your subscription to this nitwit site, as I have just done. Cheers.

  • Report this Comment On September 11, 2009, at 5:56 PM, robba67 wrote:

    This is the best comment on this article. Thanks, devandev:

    "Why is this article continuously posted on MF? (Don't let the date at the top fool you; I've seen it I don't know how many times in the past 6 months.) Why this constant denigrating of Jim Cramer? Is it because he's popular and people listen to him? So are lots of other market commentators who also make market calls and stock picks. MF's crusade against one successful TV personality is getting very, very old. Get a life. It's hard to take you seriously when your article ends with an ad for your own stock picking (pay) service. I won't be renewing my subscription."

    I'm totally turned off by this sort of mindless bashing.

    The Fool has become a cranky old coot.


  • Report this Comment On September 11, 2009, at 6:40 PM, drr808080 wrote:

    You're right about Cramer. But in this particular instance it's not for him to tell people when to "get back in." Because he was talking about money that was needed in less than 5 years. That money should never go back in, b/c it never should have been there in the first place, right?

  • Report this Comment On September 11, 2009, at 9:45 PM, Uncle2Art wrote:

    I only believe results. Comparing my Foolish experiences of 10 years and more ago, and the experience of Cramer's books and program, I'm with Cramer on this question. Why pick one particular example, when Cramer has already insisted we do our own homework before buying anything? And start getting out when we have a decent profit?

    And Cramer is essentially free. MF charges for everything you can; you always have.

    Now I'm trying your $495 options program, with no positive results so far. I may cancel next week.

    By the way, I've "earned" an average of $363. per day, 220 days a year over the last twenty-four months, through August, starting with less than $100.000; and not working all that hard at it. Cramer calls my attention to shifts in the market in time to make decent profits. No more sour grapes, please!

  • Report this Comment On September 11, 2009, at 10:23 PM, kluttzy wrote:

    I am too much of a buy-and-hold investor to be a great fan of Jim Cramer. But I used to be a great fan of Jon Stewart - until that show where he mercilessly crucified Cramer. There was no humor in that show; just pure meanness on Stewarts part. I'm done with him.

  • Report this Comment On September 12, 2009, at 2:24 AM, superflip wrote:

    Cramer promotes "buy and homework" and thinking for yourself. Most of his stock picks are nothing more than suggestions to research for yourself. He always criticizes after hours traders who buy right after his show and don't do the homework. I take everything he says with a grain of salt, as I do everything I hear on TV or read online. His suggestions have made me a little money and I've lost a bit too, but more importantly I'm learning from him. You can call him a flip-flop, but doesn't everyone change their minds about a stock from time-to-time? Sometimes he's wrong, but hasn't Buffet made some pretty big mistakes too? Besides, if I make a bad investment from his stock pick or MF I can't blame but myself.

  • Report this Comment On September 12, 2009, at 4:53 AM, justinm11 wrote:

    I was thinking seriously about canceling Stock Advisor, which is evident from my one and only post in this thread (again, very happy with stock advisor, but frustrated by this continuing article). But after the arrogant post from TMFFlightsuit I am literally canceling my service right now. Not only that, I will find Cramer's site (which I only know about from this site) and randomly subscribe to an entry level service

    Well, crap. I guess I'm actually going to have to call the 800 number. I can't cancel my account using only the website after hours. A message has been left and I will closely monitor my credit card statement.

    I hope that if Cramer becomes a douche bag and starts bashing you guys to where he clearly has an inferiority complex, his website will at least allow me to compulsively terminate my subscription without having to dial an 800 number. And I ask this in all seriousness, can somebody direct me to his website?

  • Report this Comment On September 12, 2009, at 5:04 AM, justinm11 wrote:

    Sorry, Nick. I just realized that you are the author of this journalistic endeavor. I have an honest question: do they convince you that this piece is so great that it merits an appearance on the flagship site once every few months? Or, do you fully understand that your article is crap, and participate, anyway? I seriously would like an answer to this.

  • Report this Comment On September 12, 2009, at 6:28 AM, wuff3t wrote:


    Well, thanks for your contributions over the years. You'll be sorely missed. Goodbye.

    Are you taking anyone else with you?

  • Report this Comment On September 12, 2009, at 12:08 PM, NOTvuffett wrote:

    I have seen the light! I will only listen to nick kapur and jon stewart for investing advice. That is like a think tank or something, lol.

  • Report this Comment On September 12, 2009, at 1:32 PM, LoneWolf888 wrote:

    Ah yes, the bald headed schmuck is a disaster for serious investors. But, his lame sheeple just can't get enough of his wrong-headed calls. CNBC is a disgrace in its entirety. The monkeys on Fast Money Monkeys are appalling in their traders mindset..Yet, the show and the nauseating CNBC go on.. There's just no accounting for taste .

    Losers, you deserve what you get .

  • Report this Comment On September 12, 2009, at 3:11 PM, crawlfish wrote:

    We have made nothing in the stock market over the last decade. If that trend continues I think that the market is rigged. I have took one piece of advice from Crammer. I was all invested in stocks. Now I keep about 10% in cash to buffer downturns and then I will have cash to put back in the market when stocks are cheaper. My response to the market decline last year was to squeeze my budget and find more money to invest in my deferred comp. account. I seem to want to buy when stocks are cheap. But I do not sale when they are high. I am trying to change my behavior. Buy and hold has not worked this last decade.

  • Report this Comment On September 12, 2009, at 3:18 PM, justinm11 wrote:

    Okay, first I apologize. I am indeed leaving, but I regret that I was not more civil in so doing.

    That said, I stand by my assertion that the article is not worthy of being published here. And I think the article ultimately makes your service appear second-rate. Perhaps he does this on his show (I will find out), but if once every couple of months, Cramer went out of his way to bash TMF, that would lead me to conclude that you are a threat to him and that I should probably check you guys out. Anyway, you asked for an intelligent, coherent response and I will do my best in the little time that I have.

    First, I think that this article's lack of data cited in support of its premise renders it worthless at best, and purposefully misleading at worst. I could cherry-pick two months of Albert Pujols at-bats over his nine year career and argue that he is not good at baseball. But that doesn't tell the whole story and neither does your article. If "what we do here" is critically think, I expect some sort of objective analysis on his picks - all of them - and how they have played out before concluding that he is "the closest thing to a walking, talking hazard for the individual investor."

    Second, your argument that you should never espouse taking money out of the stock market is belied by the facts, as others have pointed out. On many, many occasions, that would have worked out just fine. I completely agree that nobody can time the market, but saying that you should NEVER take money out of the stock market is quite another thing. Likewise, you insist "buy and hold" is some sort of investing axiom, while I distinctly remember that subject being debated, extensively, at this very site with good arguments made for both sides.

    Finally, and most importantly to me, it's unbecoming. If you think you are valuable and superior, keep noting that at the end of your articles. Again, I was happy with the service I purchased here and, other than your apparent fear of him, I have no reason to believe that TMF does not destroy Jim Cramer. But, I consider you guys professionals, and this isn't the marketing I expect from a professional.


  • Report this Comment On September 13, 2009, at 1:07 AM, jdlyall wrote:

    I wish that I had followed Cramer's advice and sold everything last Oct 8. I would surely be far ahead of the Million Dollar Portfolio performance the past year.

    He was right to say sell, and he has been saying buy the past four months. Unfortunately most of my money disappeared somewhere in Ireland.

  • Report this Comment On September 13, 2009, at 3:38 PM, szf27kdan wrote:

    I do not know who Nick Kapur is, but if he is a Foolish staff member, that association should be reconsidered. I agree with everyone who supports Jim Cramer and could not disagree more with what Nick said. I suspect that his real beef is that he rode the market down, lost his nest egg, sold at the bottom, didn't trust the rally, and now has sour grapes just like every other permabear that still mistrusts this rally. I have followed Cramer's advice and have made nearly 1000% since Jim's October call in the best rally this stock market has ever given the world. Such could not have been done with Nick's approach. "Buy and Hold" must be replaced with "Buy and Homework". And that means being flexible enough and intelligent enough to know when the tape is going against your positions and you need to cut your losses so that you can participate in the next rally. There is no value in waiting and no medals will be awarded for stubbornly hoping for the market you wish for. Hope does not make a good investment strategy. You have to work with the market you are given. Cramer tells us what that market is.

  • Report this Comment On September 13, 2009, at 4:00 PM, szf27kdan wrote:

    I have not given much credence to TMF even though I have been a member for quite some time simply because the few TMF "tips" I did follow lost me lots of money. So as I read the comments from the Cramer bashers and the TMF supporters, it appears to me that the those who follow the TMF methodolgy truly are foolish in the real sense of the word. Where is it stated that investors must hold their positions long-term. Guess what, the goal of investing is to make money, lots of money. And guess what, selling a position that has posted lots of returns and buying it back when its price retraces, even though all the while the company maintains a sound business case, makes one lots of money. Investors who ignore the powerful business cycle that repeats unendingly are truly foolish.

  • Report this Comment On September 13, 2009, at 4:09 PM, NOTvuffett wrote:

    Why does this thing have to be such a sore point? Take Cramer for what he is- a pundit with an opinion. His only value is to make you think. Personally, I can't stand his clown antics, but I guess that is necessary for ratings in an ADD country.

    Cramer does piss me off when he says to buy a stock only in a ridiculously low price range.

    The guy that really hacks me off on CNBC though is the trend analysis guy, if you followed his advice you would be stopped out of almost every trade.

  • Report this Comment On September 13, 2009, at 11:11 PM, Huntman24 wrote:

    You have got to be kidding!! The author says here that Cramer cost you money by making that dramatic "sell" call in October. I am pretty sure that the DJI avg. was over 10,000 when he made that call.

    Almost immediatley after that righteous call, the DOW began a 5 month "tank" down to around 6,500. That's at least a 35% mauling investors had to endure - at least the ones who stayed "all in" did. Can someone with a clear mind tell me how that could be a "bad thing"? Oh, that's right!! I forgot. The author said Cramer would have been ok if he had only told investors to get back in on March 6th; at the absolute bottom.

    Again, are you kidding??? If you're going to go WAY out of your way to brutaly attack someone, maybe you should watch his show, and maybe check out his calls since the March lows, hmmm? Because, if you did, you would have known that Cramer got very bullish before the DOW made back to 7,000. And he's been bullish ALL THE WAY BACK to where we are now, approaching that same 10,000 level. And a heck of a lot more bullish than most of the other so-called experts. Cramer even told his viewers within a day or two, about the equally herculeon call by Doug Cass who called the absolute bottom by saying "We have seen a generational low on the S&P 500".

    I don't know, maybe you should have watched the show ...and payed attention ...and did the math ...and kept this savage attack to yourself.

  • Report this Comment On September 14, 2009, at 3:07 PM, milburn64 wrote:

    Why did Jim Cramer quit his hedge fund? He tells the story of going to Thanksgiving dinner at his parent's house. The story goes his Dad told him that he (Jim) would be dead in a year or Dad would outlive him or something to that effect if he didn't slow down.

    Now to all of you who think this is a "story", I don't know if this is true or not BUT neither do you. I'm not in the habit of calling people liars with out proof.

    Hell if he wanted to be that greedy, he could have gotten a job as a CEO of a large corp. Actually probably not, he's not dumb enough.

  • Report this Comment On September 19, 2009, at 10:08 PM, 3treesout wrote:

    You guys evidently have drunk the cool aid and gone to Jim Cramer heaven. This man has flipped and flopped so much I thought I was going to put my foot through the TV many times until I eventually stopped watching to save my sanity and my portfolio. He spends most of his time hawking his books and selling his service. In May I bought a blue chip stock on my own because of the dividend and the quality of the company he pointedly said that stock was not the type of stock you should be buying "in this market". Two months later after I had sold it-at a loss-he was touting it big time on his show. He did this twice. I watched for several weeks after but never again blindly bought or sold. Finally I stopped watching and my portfolio is once again making money and I am not losing so much on commissions. What I couldn't stomach was the adulation his callers came up with. I even started questioning if those were really all legitimate callers.

  • Report this Comment On September 19, 2009, at 10:13 PM, hiddenflem wrote:

    Cramer was absolutely right...his message was COMPLETELY consistent with the philosophies I've seen espoused here. People shouldn't invest money that they will need in the near future. What exactly do you see wrong with that as a message?

  • Report this Comment On September 19, 2009, at 10:16 PM, hiddenflem wrote:

    PS=-how do we "Negative Rec" an article here?

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