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Axos Financial, Inc. (NYSE:AX)
Q3 2020 Earnings Call
Apr 29, 2020, 5:00 p.m. ET

Contents:

  • Prepared Remarks
  • Questions and Answers
  • Call Participants

Prepared Remarks:

Operator

Greeting. And welcome to the Axos Financial Third Quarter 2020 Earnings Results Conference Call. [Operator Instructions]

I would now like to turn the conference over to your host, Johnny Lai, Vice President of Corporate Development and Investor Relations. Please go ahead, sir.

Johnny Y. Lai -- Vice President of Corporate Development and Investor Relations

Thank you, and good afternoon, everyone. Thanks for joining us for Axos Financial Inc.'s Third Quarter Financial Results Conference Call. With me today are the company's President and Chief Executive Officer, Greg Garrabrants; and Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer, Andy Micheletti. Greg and Andy will review and comment on our financial and operational results for the third quarter, and they will be available to answer questions after the prepared remarks.

Before we begin, I would like to remind listeners that prepared remarks made on this call may contain forward-looking statements that are subject to risks and uncertainties and that management may make additional statements in response to your questions. Therefore, the company claims the protection from the safe harbor for forward-looking statements as contained in the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. Forward-looking statements related to the business of Axos Financial, Inc. and its subsidiaries can be identified by common use forward-looking terminology, and those statements involve unknown risks and uncertainties, including all business related risks that are more detailed in the company's filings on Form 10-K, 10-Q and 8-K with the SEC. This call is being webcast, and there will be an audio replay available for 30 days in the Investor Relations section of the company's website located at www.axosfinancial.com. All the details of this call were provided on the conference call announcement and in the press release today.

At this time, I'd like to turn the call over to Greg, who will provide opening remarks.

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Thank you, Johnny. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us. I'd like to welcome, everyone to Axos Financials conference call for the third quarter of fiscal 2020 ended March 31, 2020. I thank you for your interest in Axos Financial and Axos Bank. We had an excellent quarter with annualized double-digit loan growth, stable net interest margins, strong fee income and very low credit losses. Rather than going through the typical rundown of the quarter, I will focus my discussion on three topics: credit, capital and near-term business outlook. We have a consistent track record of maintaining low credit losses through multiple economic cycles, given our conservative underwriting guidelines senior structures in our commercial lines and loans and the collateralized nature of our loan book. During the great financial crisis, our peak annual net charge-offs for loans we originated was less than one basis point for single-family and multifamily mortgages. The vast majority of our credit losses incurred between 2008 and 2012 were for recreational vehicle loans that were discontinued in 2007.

We are confident that we will be able to weather the current economic downturn for several reasons. The vast majority of our loan portfolio is collateralized by hard assets at conservative attachment points. Our single family mortgage, multifamily and commercial real estate mortgages have low loan to values, low loan to costs and are located in markets with historically strong demand. The vast majority of our larger real estate exposures are structurally protected by relationships with large funds that are structurally subordinated to us.

Our direct exposure to unsecured consumer loans represents approximately 50 basis points of our loan portfolio. We have no exposure to credit cards and approximately $3 million of home equity lines. Although some of our asset-backed facilities and a real estate loan or two are technically classified as shared national credits because of the nature of the syndication, which we are a part, we do not have exposure to cash flow based shared national credits. We lend exclusively to prime and super prime borrowers across each of our consumer lending categories, auto, single-family mortgages and personal and secured lending. We have minimal credit exposure to airlines, malls, casinos, retailers, theme parks, hotels, oil and gas, restaurants and small businesses. We do not have mezzanine or subordinated tranches of securities in our portfolio. We do not have collateralized loans in our portfolio that are junior and rights to other loans other than the previously mentioned $3 million of home equity loans. If we take additional collateral in a second position, it is an abundance of caution and supported by a first lane on other collateral.

Approximately 95% of our loans outstanding at March 31, 2020, were collateralized by hard assets with a loan-to-value ratio in the 50s, including $9.1 billion of real estate assets and $787 million of primarily consumer receivables. Single-family mortgages representing 40% of our total loan portfolio had a weighted average loan-to-value ratio of 57%. At the end of March 31, 2020 quarter, 60% of our single-family mortgages have loan-to-value ratios at or below 60%. 33% have loan-to-value ratios between 61% and 70%. 6% have loan-to-value ratios between 71% and 80% and less than two basis points or $860,000 of combined balances have greater than 80% loan-to-value.

We have an established track record of strong credit performance in our jumbo single-family mortgage lending book, with lifetime credit losses of originated single-family loans of less than three basis points of loans originated. While we did not foresee a sharp decline in home prices nationwide on par with levels we experienced the 2007 and 2008 financial crisis, we believe that any potential losses in our single-family real estate secured loan book will be manageable even in the sharp economic and housing downturn given the desirability at low attachment points of our underlying collateral.

Multifamily loans, representing 21% of our total loan portfolio at 03/31/2020, had an average loan-to-value ratio of 51%. The lifetime credit losses in our originated multifamily portfolio are less than one basis point of loans originated over the 18 years we have originated multifamily loans. At the end of March 31, 2020 quarter, 44% of our multi-family mortgages have loan-to-value ratios at or below 55% loan-to-value, 35% have loan-to-value ratios between 56% and 65%. 20% have loan-to-value ratios between 66% and 75%, and less than 1% greater than 75 loan-to-value. The average debt service cover ratio of our multifamily loans was 150, was 1.5 at 03/31/2020. Our small balance commercial real estate loan portfolio of $410 million representing approximately 4% of our total loans at 03/31/2020, had a weighted average loan-to-value ratio of 52%. At the end of the March 2020 quarter, 49% of our small balance commercial real estate loans have loan-to-value ratios at or below 50%, 23% have loan-to-value ratios between 51% and 60%. 23% have loan-to-value ratios between 61% and 70%. 4% have loan-to-value ratios between 71% and 75% and around 1% between 76% and 80% loan-to-value.

Those higher loan-to-value loans are uniquely positioned, one of the largest loan to values one of the largest loans is secured by a state level guarantee under a special program, and all loans at that level have strong personal guarantors. In our small balance commercial real estate portfolio, we had approximately $80 million of loans to hotels and resorts, representing less than 1% of our total outstanding loans. We have an active dialogue with each of our CRE borrowers, and the weighted average loan-to-value of this book is approximately 52% and including a 49% loan-to-value for the hotel exposures. The average debt service cover of our small balance commercial real estate loan book is 1.69 at 03/31/2020. Our mortgage warehouse loan book with March 31 balances of $380 million is secured by single-family mortgages that can be sold if the borrower is unable to turn the book.

We temporarily suspended accepting non-agency mortgages other than those that we intend to fund as collateral for our mortgage warehouse facilities in mid-March due to dislocations in the secondary market for non-agency mortgages. As of April 28, 2020, we had approximately $88 million in outstanding non-agency exposure in our mortgage warehouse book or 19% of total current balances of $462 million. Our initial advance rate on non-agency loans vary between 90% and 95% of the note amount, and we typically curtail an additional 15% on day 45. Our weighted average exposure on a loan-to-value basis on the $87 million in non-agency loan balances outstanding distributed among eight different warehouse clients was 58%. Our borrowers have been actively reducing their non-agency exposure, and we have ongoing discussions to sell their remaining non-agency loans and reduce their draw on our live. We do not currently project losses from any non-agency exposure in our warehouse lending book, particularly given that the current market execution of trades is higher than our adjusted and curtailed advance rates. Our warehouse clients are benefiting from elevated levels of refinancing activity and higher margins across the industry due to capacity constraints. Our commercial loan book, including lender finance and commercial specialty real estate is comprised of loans and lines of credit secured by single-family, multifamily, commercial real estate, land and consumer receivables.

The lender finance book is comprised of real estate and non-real estate transactions. The weighted average advance rate on the real estate lender finance book is 27.2%, with no transaction with an advanced rate greater than 50%. The non-real estate lender finance book, backed primarily by consumer loans, is approximately $732 million, with an average advance rate of 27% of the outstanding receivable balances. These structures generally require rapid paydowns in the event of any significant collateral deterioration in the receivables and are also paid down rapidly in the event originations decline. We have sold an absolute discretion to approve or deny draws on all of our real estate secured lender finance and mortgage warehouse lines. The weighted average loan-to-cost on our commercial specialty real estate portfolio is 44% and with strong junior partners supporting the capital structure.

We hold a senior position in all of our lender finance and commercial specialty real estate loans, and every deal has significant capital support from borrowers and/or sponsors. We monitored the performance of the underlying collateral, housed in the bankruptcy remote special purpose vehicle, allowing us to identify credit deterioration and take swift action to protect our principal and interest. In our commercial bridge and construction portfolios, we work with experienced developers and well-capitalized sponsors such as Ares, Fortress, Madison and Blackstone. The projects are located in the gateway cities, such as Los Angeles, New York, San Diego and Denver. The average loan size is approximately $18 million. The average remaining term is 14 months, and the average loan-to-cost is 44%. We have no direct credit exposure to airlines, casinos, theme parks, oil and gas exploration companies, retailers or movie theaters. Our equipment leasing portfolio represents our entire exposure to the oil and gas aircraft and restaurant sector. In our equipment leasing portfolio, we had approximately $28 million of leases to four borrowers who provide services to the oil and gas and mining industries, a $13 million lease to the largest provider of emergency medical transportation services in the United States backed by a fleet of helicopters and $5 million of leases to a large fast casual restaurant operator that finances countertop kiosks.

The average debt service coverage ratio for the six equipment leases mentioned above was 2.87 times at the end of the third quarter. All of the above-mentioned credits were current as of March 31, 2020, although some of our leases to companies have cash flow based leverage on their balance sheet, we have no cash flow based leverage loans.

We had approximately $263 million of hotel and $97 million of retail next use exposure in our commercial specialty real estate loan portfolio, representing 2.5% and less than 1% of our total loans outstanding in March 31, 2020, respectively. The vast majority of hotel loans are AB notes that we hold a senior position and with strong with a strong funded and junior position. The only two direct hotel deals we have are one in Manhattan at a 55% loan-to-value at origination with 97% ownership by the son of a Saudi Billionaire. And the other is also in the New York area for $12.5 million with a full guarantee from an individual with a net worth of over $50 million. The hotel properties are completed and all hotels are current in their loan payments. The average loan-to-value of the hotel and retail commercial specialty real estate loans were 48%. Our non-real estate consumer lending is comprised of approximately $312 million of auto loans, $55 million of personal unsecured loans and $56 million of H&R Block refund advance loans. We saw some auto loans primarily from dealers located in 10 states and lend to prime borrowers with an average FICO score of 772. We fully underwrite and service every auto loan we hold on our balance sheet, and the portfolio continues to perform in line with expectations.

We have managed the credit risk of our personal unsecured loan book by focusing on prime borrowers with an average FICO score of 7 65 on an average loan size of $20,000. Given the rapid deterioration in the economy and the rise in unemployment nationwide, we have temporarily suspended originations of new personal unsecured loans. We originated approximately $1.36 billion of refund advance loans this quarter, up 17% for the $1.16 billion in the three months ended March 31, 2019. We have received payments for all the $56 million of the principal balances for RAs as of March 31, 2020, a pacing that is far ahead of the disclosed pacing of others in the industry. Given the 90-day extension of the federal tax filing deadline by the IRS, we anticipate a more extended repayment time frame for RAs this year compared to the prior year and cannot guarantee this extended pace will result in no incremental credit losses. In our Securities business, we ended the quarter with approximately $159 million of margin loans, down $67 million from December 31, 2019. Despite record price volatility in the stock market over the past few months, we successfully managed our margin lending business with no incurred losses. Our overall credit risk management approach is to engage in frequent communications with individual borrowers and lending partners and determine the optimal set of actions by each individual credit-based on borrower sponsor, project cash flow and liquidity.

Business unit leaders have been working with our Chief Credit Officer and his underwriting and portfolio management teams to evaluate and monitor clients that have requested forbearance and/or become delinquent in their loan payments. We have maintained an elevated cadence of communications with clients through email, phone and other channels over the past several weeks and the tenure of the conversations have been productive. Other than that as directed by Fannie and Freddie with respect to agency mortgages that we service and hold no other economic interest, we have not and will not make extended blanket load forbearances or modifications on real estate loans, but will work with borrowers on a case-by-case basis on deferral requests, while we help them manage through the negative impact from COVID-19. We believe this approach is more appropriate for our borrowers given the unique circumstance and uncertainties surrounding the near to immediate term outlook on the economy and various government restrictions have been implemented. For single and multifamily real estate loans, we have not yet granted any deferrals or long-term modifications, but rather provided 1- or 2-month forbearances to allow us to have more time to review individual circumstances.

With respect to borrowers who did not make their payment for April 1, which would have been late on April 15, meaning that they will be currently about two weeks late in the single family, multifamily and small balance commercial real estate groups and the number of those borrowers who have requested assistance that in greater than 65% loan-to-value ratios at origination represents 2.6% of the total single-family portfolio and 76 basis points of the combined multifamily and small balance commercial real estate portfolios. Since many borrowers have been told by some banks that a simple phone call is enough to obtain relatively long-term deferrals, there are customers who are calling, expecting to be granted long-term assistance for no legitimate reason. With respect to the auto lending side, deferral requests were granted for 8.7% of the portfolio and the unsecured lending side, about 4.7% of the book have requested deferrals. These are currently short-term deferrals with 90% no more than two months and around 10% receiving 3-month approvals. We are still developing how we will formulate our policies for each asset class in this regard given that each asset class has its own dynamic. For example, given the level of protective equity as well as the high default rate on our notes of 18% in our multifamily and small balance real estate book, we believe our loans will fillable quickly to opportunistic buyers if we have borrowers who simply wish to utilize loan deferrals as a temporary liquidity buffer rather than ensuring they prioritize their payment on their first mortgage.

Provisions for loan losses were approximately $28.5 million in the quarter ended March 31, 2020, up $9.5 million compared to the same period a year ago. Excluding loan loss provisions for HR block related loans in both periods, our loan loss provision was $10.8 million or $8 million or up $8 million from $2.8 million in the prior quarter. The $69.4 million of loan loss reserves x RAs for the quarter ended March 31, 2020, represented approximately 105.7% of total nonperforming assets and 22.3 times our annualized net charge-offs. Approximately $4.2 million of the $10.8 million loan loss provision x RAs in the quarter ended March 31, 2020, was attributable to loan growth and $6.6 million was attributed to the rapid and sharp deterioration in the economy. Our provisions for the March quarter were not impacted by CECL because our CECL adoption will occur by June 1, 2020. Andy will provide more detail with respect to how we were thinking about the CECL impact in his prepared remarks.

One of the benefits of the labor implementation for CECL is that we will be able to incorporate more updated information in our projections. We are encouraged by the speed and size of various fiscal and monetary actions taken by the Federal Reserve, treasury and other government agencies and believe that some of these actions will help mitigate the negative ramifications of COVID-19 on our borrowers.

We participated in the SBA's Paycheck Protection Program, originating approximately $85 million of loans for 149 existing and new clients. Even though we were an approved SBA lender, we had not previously been an originator of SBA 7(a) loans, but our technology, current and deposit team work quickly to stand up a loan portal and streamline a set of processes to quickly open deposit counts and underwrite and fund PPP loans. In addition to providing much needed capital for a subset of our borrowers, participation in the PPP program also helped generate incremental relationships and deposits for our small business and commercial banking groups. Our credit quality remains good. Our annualized net charge-offs to average loans and leases was three basis points this quarter compared to four basis points in the corresponding period last year.

Nonperforming assets, the total asset ratio was 54 basis points for the quarter ended March 31, 2020, flat from December 31, 2019. The majority of our nonperforming assets are comprised of single-family and multifamily loans with low low on the average divides, we remain well reserved with our allowance for loan loss, representing 150.7% coverage of our nonperforming loans and leases at March 31, 2020. We continue to generate strong returns with return on average common shareholders' equity of 18.65% and 15.34% in the three months and nine months ended March 31, 2020, respectively. Our efficiency ratio for the banking business segment was 33.2% for the quarter ended March 31, 2020, down over 200 basis points from 35.26% in the year ago.

Our capital ratios remained strong at 8.72% of the bank at 8.55% of the holding company. Despite a higher provision for loan loss reserves and buying back approximately $39 million of common stock at an average price of $19.74 per share this quarter. Our tangible common equity to total asset ratio remains healthy at 8.66% at March 31, 2020. Given that we believe there will be tighter credit standards coming out of these times, our top priority for capital will be to fund in our existing businesses. Although we had discussed in previous calls, starting to pay a modest dividend, given the uncertainty surrounding the economy, the global pandemic and impact on various government actions on consumer and corporate behavior, we've decided not to pay a dividend until we get better clarity on the depth and duration of economic and business disruptions. We have a healthy liquidity position set of funding. Our balance sheet deposits increased by 10.5% year-over-year, with second savings deposits increasing by 16.4%. Our commercial cash and treasury management, small business banking and specialty deposits continue to show positive growth. Average noninterest-bearing deposits increased by almost $1 billion year-over-year, led by our Axos Fiduciary Services group.

Client cash deposits from AFS and Axos securities currently held at other banks was approximately $455 million at 03/31/2020. We have the ability to bring back a good portion of our off-balance sheet deposits if it's economically advantageous to do so. We also have access to $3.8 billion of FHLB borrowing, $3 billion in excess of the $771 million we had outstanding at the end of the third quarter. Furthermore, we have $1.4 billion of liquidity available at the Federal Reserve discount window as of March 31, 2020. With many banks and fintechs reducing rates on their consumer online savings and money market deposit products, we have more flexibility to raise consumer online deposits at relatively lower all-in costs compared to three and six months ago. We have a relatively stable outlook with respect to loan growth and net interest margin. In jumbo single family mortgages, many banks and nonbanks have pulled back on the aggressive lending terms and conditions they offered in the prior 12 to 18 months. Pricing on new jumbo mortgages has tightened due to dislocation in the secondary market for non-agency mortgages and liquidity constraints for most nonbank lenders. The purchase market has weakened due to the government's stay at home and forbearance measures. We have tightened our credit underwriting standards with respect to all of our lending products. We continue to see demand for our lending products at our tight credit standards.

The multifamily and small balance CRE dynamics vary by geographic market and property type. Rent payments in our primary markets where we lend, held up relatively well in March and April. The stimulus checks forbearance programs, federal subsidies on unemployment insurance in the SBA Paycheck Protection program should provide short-term cash flow for renters and borrowers who are unable to work voluntarily or involuntarily. Supply constraints on housing and relatively diverse nature of local economies on the West Coast make multifamily and commercial real estate markets attractive in the medium to long term. How quickly economies are able to resume normal levels of production and productivity will dictate the short-term dynamics in these two loan categories. Also, we do not know whether governmental intervention and rent collection eviction for closure processes will impact our willingness to continue to lend or impact our ability to manage our loan book.

In our two largest C&I lending categories, lender, finance and commercial specialty real estate, we continue to evaluate new opportunities, but are pivoting to leverage real estate assets at even more conservative advance rates than previous. Given the current environment, we'll be able to deploy capital senior to our funding partners where we can obtain better economics on loans and obtaining higher margins of safety and better structures. With respect to auto and personal unsecured lending, we have temporarily suspended originations for all the prime borrowers with a minimum FICO of 7 20 and significantly tighten credit standards until we have more information about when employees will be allowed to go back to work and what restriction on commerce and travel may remain in place and before we look to grow either of these consumer lending portfolios.

We're actively originating and funding PPP loans for existing and new Axos customers. These forgivable loans, which are 100% guaranteed by the SBA and carry 0% risk weighting and remain on our books until we sell them back to the SBA or utilize the federal reserves funding facility.

Through April 27, we have originated and funded approximately $85 million of PPP loans and have a backlog of $38 million in various stages of processing. We will receive a onetime processing fee between 1% and 5% of the principal amount of PPP loans we originated based on the size of each law. We are delighted to be able to help small businesses nationwide stay open and pay their employees during these challenging times. We continue to maintain stable net interest margins despite significant flattening of the yield curve and the shift in competitive dynamics across various lending and deposit categories. Excluding the impact from H&R Block related loans and deposits, our net interest margin for the banking business was 3.85% compared to 3.87% in the prior quarter and 3.9% in the third quarter of 2019. On the asset side, approximately 61% of our loans are 51 arms so single-family and multifamily mortgages with the underline collateral. With a slowdown in prepay activity and stability in new jumbo mortgage and multifamily loan yields, we expect to maintain overall yields in our jumbo single-family mortgage loan book and our multifamily loan book. The majority of our small balance commercial real estate portfolio, which represents another 4% of our loan balances at 03/31/2020, our term loans with fixed interest rates and staggered prepayment penalties through the first five years of the law. Approximately 5% of our multifamily and CRE loan portfolio is currently above their floor rates. With competitors pulling back from small balance CRE, we see opportunities to improve yield while maintaining low loan to values and high debt service coverage. In our C&I loan book, our asset-based lender finance and commercial specialty real estate portfolios have rates that adjusted the index.

Of the $3.3 billion of lender finance commercial specialty real estate loans, approximately 70% are at their floor rates. Our equipment leasing portfolio, which accounted for the remaining $162 million of C&I loan outstanding is comprised of fixed rate loans and leases. On the funding side, we are well positioned given the diversity of our consumer and commercial businesses and the optionality of our security based deposits. Consumer deposits representing approximately 55% of our total deposits of 03/31/2020 is comprised of consumer direct checking, savings, money market and noninterest-bearing prepaid accounts. Excluding consumer time deposits, our consumer checking and money market balances increased by $916 million from 12/31/2019 with strong growth in our noninterest-bearing prepaid and other interest bearing demand deposit balances. We reduced our high-yield savings and money market deposit rates in March following the Fed's actions. We prepaid $200 million of brokered CDs with an average cost of funds of 2 71 and reissued a similar amount at 1.78 in the third quarter. Average noninterest-bearing deposits was $2.6 billion in the quarter ended March 31, 2020, up by almost $1 billion compared to the same period a year ago. We are making good progress in our specialty commercial and treasury management businesses, and our involvement with the SBA PPP program will provide additional momentum for small business and commercial deposits. Axos clearing benefited from a flight to safety this quarter with ending deposits increasing by approximately 16% linked quarter to $413 million.

These client deposits held an approximately 90,000 individual brokerage accounts provide a stable low source of funding. We have chosen to keep the majority of the $413 million in other banks, earning interest income for the securities business. We have the ability to bring these deposits back to our bank on relatively short notice to fund our loan growth. The impact of consolidation in this industry, we continue to be bullish on the clearing company's long-term outlook. Overall, we feel good about our ability to maintain an annual net interest margin toward the lower end of our 3.8 to 4.0 target. With loan growth likely to be slow in the short-term and some additional downward pricing flexibility in some of our deposit categories, we look to hold margins relatively stable.

Now I'll turn the call over to Andy, who will provide additional details on our fiscal year results.

Andrew J. Micheletti -- Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer

Thanks, Greg. First, I wanted to note that in addition to our press release, our 10-Q was filed with the SEC today and is available online to edge group or through our website at axosfinancial.com. Second, I will provide brief comments on several topics. Please refer to our press release or 10-Q for additional details. Axos net income for the third quarter ended March 31, 2020, was $56.1 million, up 44.4% year-over-year and up 35.7% compared to our last quarter ended December 31, 2019. The increase in net income this quarter compared to the last quarter ended December 31, 2019, is primarily due to growth in the loan portfolio of 2.3%, and additional income from seasonal income tax products, partially offset by our higher loan loss provisions and higher operating expenses. The growth in net income year-over-year is primarily due to loan portfolio growth of 14% and increased mortgage banking revenue and lower operating expenses. Operating expenses for Q3 of 2019 includes a onetime charge of $15.3 million for an uncollected receivable in our securities business. Increased quarterly net income was the result of operating expense efficiency, improvement both year-over-year and on a linked-quarter basis. The efficiency ratio was 39.85% for the quarter ended March 31, 2020, and an improvement year-over-year of 292 basis points when compared to the 42.77% efficiency ratio calculated without the $15.3 million onetime charge recognized in expense last year.

For the quarter ended December 31, 2019, the efficiency ratio was 51.66%, improving to 39.85% and for the quarter ended March 31, 2020, primarily due to income from seasonal tax products. Mortgage banking income for the quarter ended March 31, 2020, was $3 million, up from $0.4 million last year and up from $2.2 million for the last quarter ended December 31, 2019. The $3 million mortgage banking income for this quarter was net of a writedown of the fair value of our mortgage servicing rights of $1.7 million generally due to the decline in long-term U.S. treasury interest rates, while future declines in long-term U.S. treasury rates are possible the low level of interest rates today, additional large declines in the value of our mortgage servicing rights are not likely. For the third quarter of fiscal 2020, noninterest expense was $71.8 million, up $4.8 million compared to our last quarter ended December 31, 2019. Salaries and related costs increased $2.3 million, primarily due to increased payroll taxes, 401(k) matching and a small staffing increase. FDIC and regulatory fees increased $1 million due to a small bank assessment credit that had been received from the FDIC in the prior quarter. Also, general and administrative expenses increased $2 million, of which $1.5 million of that increase related to processing costs associated with the seasonal tax products.

As Greg noted earlier, we did not adopt CECL this quarter ended March 31, 2020. And therefore, we recorded our loan loss provisions this quarter using the incurred loss method. The FASB's original timetable for adoption for public companies with accounting year-end at June 30 was on or before July 1, 2020. We currently expect to meet that deadline rather than extend the adoption date as recently permitted in the Cares act in response to COVID-19. To prepare for CECL implementation, we have created life of loan loss models based upon our portfolio characteristics. Using industry forecasted macroeconomic data, these models produce low level probabilities of default and loss given defaults to estimate loss over the entire life of the loan. We are currently making modifications to these models based upon recommendations of our third party consultants. Upon the adoption of CECL, we expect a material increase in our allowance for credit losses and likely increases in future loss provisions. The amount of the increase will depend in part on changes to forecasted macroeconomic inputs resulting from COVID-19 pandemic and its future impact upon the economy. For regulatory capital purposes, when we adopt CECL, we expect to elect the 2-year delay and the 5-year total transition period to minimize the impact of the increase in our allowance for credit losses on our capital ratios.

With that, I'll turn the call back over to Johnny Lai.

Johnny Y. Lai -- Vice President of Corporate Development and Investor Relations

Thanks, Andy. Operator, we're ready to take questions.

Questions and Answers:

Operator

Thank you. [Operator Instructions] Your first question comes from the line of Michael Perito with KBW. Please proceed with your question.

Michael Perito -- KBW -- Analyst

Hey, good afternoon, guys. I'm glad to hear it like it seems like everyone's soon well under the circumstances. I wanted to start on kind of a COVID-19 response that you guys laid out in your prepared remarks. I was curious, I mean, it did seem like through the quarter end, based on the numbers you laid out, Greg, that there was much deferral activity, and I know you guys said you're kind of working through it here. It sounds like in the near term, but I was just curious if you can maybe give us a little bit more kind of context around what the decision-making process kind of looks like, and where you ultimately expect the deferral rate to kind of move to based on the applications or requests you've received thus far?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

So as of the end of the quarter, there really wasn't much of anything at all. Subsequent to that, there have been requests coming in. I gave the numbers for the auto and unsecured lending book, and those are current numbers. With respect to the real estate loan portfolio on the kressel side with respect to the transactions we work with sponsors on. Essentially, there's been no requests that are simply deferral-oriented requests with respect to things to the extent that someone wants to do the normal course extend alone or that sort of thing, they may be paying something down or working with us, to do that, but nothing's really substantive there either. On the single and multifamily side, there's been requests in the agency book that we are filing government guidelines on. And then for the remainders, of the loans with respect to this.

We're not really doing some maybe very short-term deferrals. And then we're going to go back and create a process to really look at each underlying asset and decide exactly what to do. So I think in most cases, these are very desirable properties. They're low loan to values. We expect people in general, obviously, each one is going to have its own dynamic, but we expect them to be working hard to make their payments. Those of you we're not going to defer or grant some modifications or deferrals, we just haven't really had a lot of time right now to assess the individual circumstances of the borrowers. And so that's we intend to do. And the level that we actually do this assessment is going to be dependent upon the type of request that they have.

Michael Perito -- KBW -- Analyst

No, that's helpful. So I mean, it sounds like there is some expectation from you guys that the deferral will increase, but it doesn't seem like it's anything really very significant at this point, I guess, to just put broad terms around it?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Yes. Look, I think that it's certainly hard to tell because at times, you get the first what we did at first was to say that we would grab somebody the ability to skip one payment, and a lot of the folks just said, why, I was going to get six months for nothing, and we told them no and they just paid. So it's a little bit difficult to tell because as you're kind of working through this, it's really too early to tell because you don't know how much of this is simply opportunistic behavior, and how much of it is a legitimate disruption from a business that will come back, right. I mean, obviously, the intellectual framework for this is that deferring someone who has no chance of coming back is probably not that useful, deferring somebody who you want to maintain as a customer who are simply suffering from some temporary impact, probably makes more sense.

So an assessment is required in order to understand how that works. And as I said, each individual asset class has its own dynamic, and that dynamic might be influenced by the nature of government rules with respect to actual execution of remedies respect to lenders. So for example, if you're a multifamily borrower, and you just decided to ask for a blanket set of long-term deferrals, a lot of people who want those properties, and a lot of people are willing to buy nodes that have 18% default interest. So that might not be the right approach. Maybe you'll go get a second lien on that property or something, and we'll help facilitate that for you so that you have someone that has an interest in that property and can help you through that, but those are the type of things that are just it's just too early right now. I mean, really, this is very recent. As of March 31, there really wasn't much. And then there have been folks who've come in, and there's been a decent number of requests, and we've been we've been working on what we're going to do to evaluate them.

Michael Perito -- KBW -- Analyst

Got it. And then on the PPP, I think it was $85 million that you guys have approved, and you could get another 30-somethingin the pipeline. I think you mentioned in your remarks that fee rate can range from 1% to 5%, but it seems like a lot of your peers are kind of oscillating around that 3% mark. Do you think that's a reasonable assumption for you guys involved at this point given what you've seen?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Yes, 3% to 3.5%, I think, is probably reasonable.

Michael Perito -- KBW -- Analyst

Okay. A couple of other questions. On H&R Block, I was just curious, it seemed like they had a pretty productive quarter actually revenues were off, but I mean, refund advances were up rather, as you guys mentioned, but I know there's still some uncertainty about kind of the duration and the status of that relationship. Is there any update there that you guys can provide?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Not at this time.

Michael Perito -- KBW -- Analyst

Okay. And then just lastly, can you remind us to the extent that the COVID-19 pandemic rather has a material impact on small business. Can you just remind us a little bit about the Epiq bankruptcy business, and if there is an increase in bankruptcies in the United States, how that necessarily would benefit that business and as a result, Axos Financial?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Yes, certainly. So that business has about 40% of of the U.S. bankruptcy trustee market that runs through and that's the Chapter seven side only, 40% of U.S. bankruptcy to trustees, roughly, give or take, a couple of percent are use our software. Everyone who uses our software is required to hold their liquidity at Axos Bank right now. And so to the extent that Chapter seven bankruptcies increase and those bankruptcies have significant assets and those assets are subject to liquidations or other types of dispositions and then there's a timeframe, often that is significant in which those distributions need to occur as part of that entire bankruptcy process. Those deposits will be held at our institution.

That's the Chapter seven part of the business. Now the non-Chapter seven part of the business utilizes the software and all its services to deal with a variety of other issues and types of clients, SEC receivers, other types of receiverships, potentially other types of bankruptcies that don't have the more formulaic process of Chapter seven bankruptcies. And often, those firms that deal with the Chapter seven side have other businesses they're also working through that are related to the things the types of activity there would likely be expected to increase in the market. So right now, it's obviously too early. I know that everybody feels like each day is each day is a week now I mean you have to remember, this is a relatively short period of time into this. So obviously, we do expect bankruptcy filings to increase, but that's going to be something, and that will lead to enhanced business. It's just we don't have a great visibility into that right now. It really is still early.

Michael Perito -- KBW -- Analyst

Yes. It is fair to think about that business as kind of a countercyclical banking business that in a period of economic stress could theoretically give you guys some more liquidity and revenue opportunities that would be kind of contrary to what traditional banking businesses how they would perform?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Yes, that's correct. I mean, in 2010, the deposits were twice what they are now. I would expect. That's I mean and look, sometimes, it's interesting, right, because sometimes you have if you have a big bankruptcy and that's put on the wheel, meaning who gets it, it could be massive, right? So there's but it definitely is a countercyclical business. I would be shocked if it didn't get bigger, and we're preparing for the throughput that we think we'll have. I think it's very difficult to see a situation where Chapter seven bankruptcies don't increase as a result of all of these lockdowns and various mitigating measures that have been taken.

Michael Perito -- KBW -- Analyst

Yeah. Great. Great. Thank you for taking my questions and stay Well,

Operator

Thank you. Your next question comes from the line of Steve Moss with B. Riley FBR. Please proceed with your question.

Steve Moss -- B. Riley FBR -- Analyst

Good afternoon. I want to start with the disruption in the mortgage market and in particular, just on the non-QM and jumbo product that you guys offer. Just wondering, even with tightening standards, Greg, you mentioned that you're still seeing demand, kind of what is that demand these days and how you're thinking about that?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Sure. So as you know, we previously had a robust growth business in jumbo mortgages. And over the last, I'll call it, six quarters or almost two years that has had disappointing growth as a result of the market sort of running away from us in what we felt was an imprudent manner and that has completely and totally reversed. So all of those competitors are gone and not just a little gone all the way gone. And so we had not compromised our credit standards in order to meet that competition. We lost a lot of business as a result of it. That business is now all flowing back, but the reality of it is we've tightened our credit standards across all products, including liquidity standards holding, 12 months of reserve, a six-month, in this case, we're holding six months of reserves, a bunch of other things, tightened LTV standards. So we are getting, obviously, lots of calls.

The pipeline is very large. I think the question is going to be obviously, we try to screen that pipeline performs in, but I would also expect that pipeline to have a larger fallout than it otherwise would as the market adjusts to the reality that these loans are going to be lower LTVS. There's going to be adjustments to the appraisals as a result of the market circumstance. There's going to be much more stringent liquidity requirements and standards. There's going to be escrows for taxes and insurance, and there's just going to be a bunch of things that are appropriate for the environment that we may be heading into, recognizing that we always plan for home values to go down by a lot, and we're still going to make sure that we're doing loans that are safe and secure.

Steve Moss -- B. Riley FBR -- Analyst

Okay. That's helpful. And then in terms of the margin here, just want to get some color on funding costs. Curious as to what you're seeing as of March 31 and where funding costs could go over the next six months?

Andrew J. Micheletti -- Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer

Yes. There's a couple of just general points I can give you, particularly when you look at our CD side, we have approximately a $300 million more in CDs that have callable options on them, which means I can retire them and reprice them at significantly lower rates at least 100 basis points lower for the same duration that we had them on. So that's a key opportunity when you look at reducing it. And in fact, also in the CD costs for this quarter, there was $1.1 million of early amortization of brokered CDs premiums. So when we call these CDs, obviously, any unamortized commission has to be recognized. So just by taking that $1 million out of this quarter, that should reduce the cost by at least 10 basis points that you see in the REIT volume table in the 10-Q. So I think we've got plenty of opportunities in the CDs to reprice, obviously, on just traditional deposits. We're growing both consumer and business. Our rates are attractive. The PPP program is also adding deposit accounts because we are requiring deposit accounts. So all of that is being added at lower rates, and we expect that to continue to drive our costs lower. In the end, I think Greg's guidance was we expect to continue to maintain our traditional non-block rate of between 4% and 3.8% on our NIM. And his guidance, we're a little bit closer to the lower end of that. And we don't see why we can't continue to maintain that going forward.

Steve Moss -- B. Riley FBR -- Analyst

All right, thank you very much.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Andrew Leisch with Piper Sandler. Please proceed with your question.

Andrew Leisch -- Piper Sandler -- Analyst

Just one follow-up question for me. You covered the rest of them. On expenses, I know there have been a lot of business development plans that you guys have had in spending initiatives out there. Like what's the outlook for that in this environment? Are there any plans to do slow them? And then just at a high level, recognizing that there are some seasonal costs from the tax business. Should we expect to see operating costs fall below, say, $69 million for the quarter?

Andrew J. Micheletti -- Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer

Sure. No. I mean, I think the our increases quarter on a linked-quarter basis really came in a couple of ways. I think, as you noted, there's $1.5 million in other general and administrative costs that you can take out for next quarter since that's exclusively related to the tax season. In our personnel costs, the majority, about half of the $2.3 million increase was simply due to FICA. This is a brand-new court for FICA expense for employees that they employer pace, and that's about half the increase. So that will continue, but maybe $500,000 of it was more onetime associated with 401(k). So you can probably look at salaries costs being similar slightly lower for next quarter. And everything else in there is fairly normalized. We, at this point, aren't looking at too many huge projects. So I think but we're always planning and that could change down the road. But in the end, the $69 million you're using is pretty close.

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Yes. One clarification, as I said I said that lender finance plus crestal book had around 70% of the floor. It's actually 63%. So and then with respect to your question, Andrew, I think Andy had it exactly right. We basically have everyone that we need now to do all the things that we need to do pretty much with one or two other folks. So the improvements in UDB are going well. We've got a lot of we've got a lot of opportunities to improve our operating efficiency with respect to a lot of different tools that we've developed over time, and those tools were really incredibly important in our ability to very seamlessly adapt to the majority of people work from home and all these other things. So they're everything from ticketing systems throughout the organization, robotic process automations, the ability to have a large team of developers who can develop portals to communicate with borrowers, to enhance our abilities to be able to respond quickly to our customers and all those things. And so there's a lot of really good technology that we've put in. And now I think a lot of it's really time to benefit from that and to try to start reaping some of the fruits of that hard labor that's happened over the and investments that's happened over the last couple of years.

Andrew Leisch -- Piper Sandler -- Analyst

Great. Yeah, I covered on my other questions. Thanks.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of David Chiaverini with Wedbush. Please proceed with your question.

David Chiaverini -- Wedbush -- Analyst

Hi, thanks. I wanted to start with a question on credit. It seems most of your loan portfolio is very well secured, but I was curious what loan exposures do you consider the most at risk? Is it the refund advance loans, hotel, other unsecured consumer? Just curious as to what you're considering the most at risk?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Right. So with respect to their refund advance loans, they did pay at a slower level than they had in the past. Now when we compare that to the other large players who publicly disclosed that, they were around, was it 7%?

Andrew J. Micheletti -- Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer

It was 7%.

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

7% out and we're 4% out, and they typically, I think, do a little bit than we do on the credit side, but they're basically in line. So from a pacing perspective, we're better, but that doesn't mean that we're both not going to be worse, right? So I think we put a little loan loss into that. We're looking at that. When we look at it, and we dissect the data, it appears to be that simply it's just slower payments, but that's unknown. So that's out there. There is a guarantee after our fee there's a guarantee from H&R Block, so we never lose more than our fee, but obviously, we like we want to get paid for this. We didn't do this for really immensely purposes. So we can't lose more than what we earned on this. But well, at least at the level it's at now, H&R Block guarantees that after that amount up to a certain amount, which we will collect. So that's that piece.

So the fee could be at risk, although we don't think so. This is something different. From an unsecured perspective, it's interesting. Right now, there's been a relatively low level of request for deferrals. We've gone through the book, and we've looked at where people work, and we've looked at our exposure to individuals that work in restaurants and work in areas that we think could be negatively impacted or shut down, that would be sort of the first-line effect of this, and it didn't look too bad. Now right. The impact of this is interesting, though, I know some people in the medical profession here, radiologists who have been laid off because in San Diego, there aren't really any COVID-19 patients. And so the hospitals are empty. And so our government has decided that elective surgeries are bad, so we're laying off medical professionals, right? So those are the type of folks that we lent to because we looked at each individual loan, and there was an actual underwriter who made a decision about it based on employment stability and things like that. So depending upon how that works, you don't expect medical professionals to they might need a deferral, but you don't expect them to actually default over time when they had prime credit scores.

So that is so that is that's that book. With respect to the single and multifamily side, I think the exposure is low, but it will relate to the potential that government action interferes in two places. First will be in the ability to collect rents where a lot of the folks that, frankly, are in our housing are going to get more money from unemployment than they would from working. However, if their neighbor is not paying the bill, and they look at the neighbor and they say, "Gee, I can wait 12 months, and I have an eviction moratorium that I may be opportunistic and take advantage of that." That flows downhill. The other would be if there's an attempt to have a state level interference with the ability to foreclose, thereby rendering the time frame, you have to hold loans longer. Now the reality of that is that our loan-to-value ratios and at the default rates we have in the commercial lending book, that could be a very profitable enterprise, but that's also not something that generally banks like to do just because it causes noise, right? And so I think there's obviously, the opportunity to sell those notes if that ever came about. These are again, these are all hypothetical situations that aren't currently happening, but they're there. The other book, the Creswell book and those elements are most of these sponsors are very embedded in these loans. So if you look at a typical loan and you use it as an example, you have about whatever our capital stack is they've got about half above us, maybe a little bit less, and if they don't take care of that property, they get wiped out on day 1.

A very, very harsh remedy and one that I don't believe that they're going to be interested in partaking in absent dramatic reductions in values in property. If there is 50% of long-term reductions in property with little hope of recovery then you might see people start to do things like that. However, then what is our loss rate going to be when we're at a 50% attachment point, we might lose a little money here or there, but probably not. And the other element is, each of these funds want to buy the others payer, right? So they all want if you have one from another fund, and they say, wait, if I get the opportunity to buy a note where I can take advantage of this. They want that note, right? So that market is very active, and these are some of the world's biggest funds there I just do not foresee them deciding that they're going to take massive losses at that level. So where does it come from? It comes in drips and drabs in the areas where you get someone that you're trying to work through something and maybe there's a maintenance challenge or they're overwhelmed, and there's some sort of issue with the property. In the last crisis, we had one where we're in at a pretty good loan-to-value ratio, but there was it was a borrower had a maintenance challenge.

The maintenance person had an issue, and there was significant property damage. Insurance was problematic with respect to how they wanted to pay, and there was some damage that, that was problematic. And then there was some vandalism. And there was we ultimately didn't take a loss on that, but it was close, closer than I thought it would be. So there's those idiosyncrasies. You have to watch fraud in these markets. We're watching the agency mortgages very carefully in the warehouse lending group. That business is going very well and expanding, but people are always when there's economic pressure, other places, you have to be careful with that. I think it's really more about if you get some irrationality from governments or regulators, then you can force things to happen in ways that don't make any sense. And the reality of things are everybody's acting like they're going to be rational right now. And that question is, does that last over an extended period of time? And I think that's really the question that you have to look at, and you have to be prepared for.

David Chiaverini -- Wedbush -- Analyst

That's very helpful. And then shifting gears, I want to ask about I think the next milestone for the Universal Digital Bank was to get it to allow a single integrated enrollment process. And I was curious, with everything that's happening with COVID and work from home, has the time line been impacted at all in terms of building out that next phase? Any disruption there?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

In general, not at any material way. The certainly, the work from home element has not impacted anything. In fact, I've been just being perfectly blunt. I've been very clear with everyone, and I hold myself at this standard. This is the time that everyone works harder. This is not a time when everyone works less. So everyone is working harder now than they have for the right reasons to take care of the borrowers to make sure that we're adapting to make sure that we are living up to our vision of being a truly digital-first bank that's a leader in technology. I don't think that, that's changed. I think with respect to the question of your categorization of the goal of universal enrollment, I would say that there really are a variety of goals that UDB had. I would say that, that goal of universal enrollment is, frankly, one, I understand what you mean by it, but what we've really been trying to focus most on is, I would say, universal integration and servicing, meaning that what we're trying to do is ensure that all of the elements that the reasons why someone would contact us in banking are going through our portal.

So from a servicing perspective, if there's an insurance update or need or an individual who wants to tell us about their travel the travel x plans and maybe less so now. But I think they would like a temporary increase and managing their debit card in a more productive way, the goal is to take and create this self-service environment that allows individuals to have a better experience, not have to go through a call center, even though it is available and to make that process more efficient. And so that's very important. The other is to integrate UDB for small business. We have a small business platform right now. That for enterprises that are that have more than one owner, and those don't go through EDB right now. And that experience is nowhere near as good.

There's a very robust road map. We have put off a couple of long-term goals. This intermittently to focus on building out the SBA PPP platform and a few other items that are unique to this environment, such as better communications with respect to customer requests through UDB and the ability to upload documents and things like that. But in general, I think by October, we still expect to have the Universal Digital Bank experience available to our clearing clients. And that, we think, is going to be nice because it's going to enable us to get access to more than 100,000 high net worth customers. We intend to sell banking products to and our clearing company clients are very excited about. And then we will have online trading capacity available, and we're testing that in with test accounts and those sort of things, and we'll be working on that as well. So it's a very robust planned. It's very exciting. It gets overshadowed by, obviously, all the current circumstances. And I think it has a lot of long-term benefits for efficiency and for revenue over the intermediate term.

David Chiaverini -- Wedbush -- Analyst

Great, thanks very much.

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Thank you.

Operator

The next question comes from the line of Mitch Hemmelgarn with Shaker Investments. Please proceed with your question.

Mitch Hemmelgarn -- Shaker Investments -- Analyst

That's Edward Hemmelgarn. But Andy, just one question for you is just with the CECL implementation at the next quarter at the end of the year. Will that the original provision, will that go through retained earnings or income?

Andrew J. Micheletti -- Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer

Yes. So the way it works and it's called generally day one and day two. You were on the day you adopted. You make a direct and assuming you're increasing your allowance, you would apply a tax rate to that increase and then you charge it directly against stockholders' equity on a GAAP basis. So it doesn't run through the income statement. It goes straight into equity. After that day one entry, it becomes your provisions become normal, i.e., all your provisions run through the income statement as they do today. So but the big difference is that for regulatory capital purposes, the rules were changed recently such that a 100% of it is actually added back to your regulatory capital for a period of two years and then phased out for another three years, so you have five years of so-called transition before it really impacts your regulatory capital ratios.

Mitch Hemmelgarn -- Shaker Investments -- Analyst

And Greg, one more question. Just you've always been very opportunistic about when opportunities present themselves. In terms of lending, you mentioned that the competition is got going away or the aggressive competition is going away in the first jumbo mortgage area. Any other areas that you think there might be some opportunities?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Yes. I think that a lot of real estate lender finance had moved away to these gestation lines at very high advance rates that some banks are stuck with now that we never did. And those loans were sometimes they would do these 12-month gestation facilities with securitization exits. Those are all gone. A lot of it's amazing what people put on repo facilities without going into detail on it, it would surprise you. You wouldn't expect that you should put long term, let's say, commercial real estate loans with incremental funding structures on a repo facility, yet it was done. So I think there's we have the same team, we have the playbook. We know how to do this. We're not in that crisis. What we took advantage of on all those loan structures are very well-developed here. They're very conservative. I think that there's a little bit of an equity gap in the market right now.

Funds can fill that equity gap, but if you had an advance rate our old advance rates were $0.45 on the dollar, let's say, and people are interested in that again, which is great. The problem is if you had got $0.85 for a while, you have a transition, and that transition is a difficult one, and it's one that takes some time. So there are opportunities in the market, but we are not always able to sell those opportunities individually, but we do have partners that can assist more globally with that. But obviously, in certain cases, there's need for equity. So I feel good about that. It's early, but there's been a lot of productive discussions, and I think they'll be coming out of this. It should be the case that some of the competition, which essentially, we had $1 billion loan books in certain categories that essentially went to 0. And there'll be opportunities in those loan categories again.

Mitch Hemmelgarn -- Shaker Investments -- Analyst

Great, thanks.

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Thanks, Ed.

Operator

Our next question comes from the line of David Feaster with Raymond James. Please proceed with your question.

David Feaster -- Raymond James -- Analyst

I just want to add I just want to start the securities business. Volatility like this often creates pretty significant disruption. And I was just curious whether you've been able to add new broker-dealers or investment advisors, given all the disruption?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Yes. We have a pipeline. Candidly, I'd like that pipeline to be bigger. I think that it's coming. For example, that business is in Omaha, and TD is in Omaha, and so getting talent to Omaha has become a lot easier now that obviously, you have this merger on the horizon, and that has really helped us, so we've been able to pick off opportunistic talent. There's lots of good discussions with RIAs from a custody perspective, who are very worried. Often, they didn't want to be at or they left for TD, and now they're being pulled back in. There's obviously folks who were part of some acquisitions at E-trade, names are looking at trying to figure out exactly how to be part of an organization where they matter and where someone will return their calls other than through a call center. So I think there is a lot of opportunity there.

With respect to what we're doing on that business, on the clearing side, we are trying to bring all the technology that we have into the operational environment to make sure that we can handle additional capacity. So the people there work very hard. They've done an amazing job managing through this liquidity without losses. I mean, obviously, you've seen there's been interactive broker and other things have had some interesting disclosures that they've had to make. A lot of companies had issues. Obviously, we had one, which was a one-off last year. So I'm not there's never any rest, but they did a great job this quarter. And so we're working a lot on the operational efficiency side there, making good progress. They're learning to adopt a culture of execution that is a lot sharper than they've had before. And I think there's really great long-term opportunities because the disruption in this these markets are massive, and we're just beginning to see the results of that disruption.

So on the clearing side, I think we have a pretty good platform, and we have interest. We have to get more credibility with larger firms. We've had some looks, but it is a tough it's a tough thing to get somebody to switch. And then on the RIA custody side, we are currently working with some hardy folks who are bringing us assets and frankly, helping us make sure that we're working out the kinks with both the on-boarding and the platform overall. We have a new software that we're implementing that is going well, and that platform will develop over time. It's not going to be immediate. It's a longer-term initiative, but I think it's if you look out three to five years, I think everybody is going to be very happy that we spent the time to do something unique on bringing a universal platform to the end client and bringing a great technology and servicing system to that business. On the robo advisory, the managed portfolio side, as we're calling it, we are I've appreciated the no-fee model. That's been great for a while. It's useful for acquisition. Also, frankly, I've told the team, you've had some opportunities, and now you're going to go make money. So we're going to be working on what that model looks like, but they will be making money shortly. They have a nice portfolio of assets, and they provide a great service. And so they're going to go make money on that pretty soon, and I've had about because the clearing company makes money, and the issue is the net loss that you see in the segment is from the managed portfolio side and that's going to end. So we were they had a view that they wanted to try to grow the business with that model. I think we had a nice run-up to had some growth, but we can grow it by adding value rather than absolutely being we may still be the lowest cost provider. We just don't have to be the lowest cost provider by that amount.

David Feaster -- Raymond James -- Analyst

Got it. And then just what are you seeing in the specialty CRE segment? I mean, I know you deal with premier developers that are very well capitalized, but just curious, your thoughts on this segment, what you're hearing from the clients and just your thoughts on that segment more broadly near term?

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Yes. I think that the nature of that segment is going to be and its activity is going to be determined by junior capital. And so if you think about, let's say, a funding structure for a project, and these obviously are just rough numbers, but if you have a situation where, let's say, there's $100 million project, equity was going to put in $20 million, the junior was going to put in $40 million, and we were going to put in $40 million, right? So and what our $40 million is going to come after all of that $60 million, and it's going to come in only after all that is already there. And so that a couple of things. It obviously makes the hurdle rates with respect to the project higher because the junior capital is looking around saying,

"Gee, I have a lot of interesting opportunities, and there's a lot of current developments." So it will be interesting to see how it goes. I think there will be selected projects that get off the ground. I think junior capital is working through what they want to do. I think there's lots of discussions and lots of asking for what term sheets would look like and not a lot of movement. I think the market is really trying to figure out exactly where things are. They clearly are good projects. There clearly are folks that have a lot invested and are going to deliver. I think that's good. It's going to be interesting, though, to see how that develops. And my inclination is that I think the junior capital is going to look for opportunities some of which they may find more attractive in existing assets and helping others through their problems rather than going after new things, but that's speculation, it's still too early. Yes.

David Feaster -- Raymond James -- Analyst

Yes, that makes sense. Last one from me. Just wanted to get your thoughts on your capital priorities near term. I mean, dividends sounds like it's on hold for now, but just thoughts on repurchases or any other opportunistic investments or even potential M&A maybe in the Fintech side given the disruption and being able to pick up a complementary business that you've been eyeing for a while? Right. Yes, I think with respect to the dividend side, I talked about that. The share repurchase side, I think look, I think that's something that we've been we haven't we did a little bit. We never we're very thoughtful about our capital. I'm not going to make any prophylactic rules on that, but or make any statement of absolution in either way there, but clearly, there's a lot of opportunities in the market. We also have uncertainty with respect to what happens in the future and so you're weighing all those different elements. Clearly, we want to have capital for growth that's prudent when there. We want to support our clients where we have good opportunities. I think there will be good yielding opportunities at very good credit profiles here. So we want to make sure that we're there for that and also make sure, obviously, that we're thoughtful about our capital. So the with respect to the M&A side, that depends upon what you're getting with the platform. So I think, unfortunately, a lot of the Fintechs with respect to the platform, they're either going to work through it with respect to their existing assets and their debt levels or things like that or they're kind of kind of have to wind down for a while and see where they go. There may be one-off opportunities like there were with respect to the robo advisory platform that we purchased, where it comes with an asset base that has no negative credit, potential credit consequences or not, but obviously, I think we've tried very hard to be thoughtful about what we put on the books. And there were strong credit thesis for each one. So there'd have to be a very strong credit thesis that would have to accompany anything that would involve taking on any credit risk in an M&A right now. That's helpful. Thank you. So thank you very much. We'll talk to you next quarter.

Operator

[Operator Closing Remarks]

Duration: 86 minutes

Call participants:

Johnny Y. Lai -- Vice President of Corporate Development and Investor Relations

Gregory Garrabrants -- President, Chief Executive Officer

Andrew J. Micheletti -- Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer

Michael Perito -- KBW -- Analyst

Steve Moss -- B. Riley FBR -- Analyst

Andrew Leisch -- Piper Sandler -- Analyst

David Chiaverini -- Wedbush -- Analyst

Mitch Hemmelgarn -- Shaker Investments -- Analyst

David Feaster -- Raymond James -- Analyst

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