Alex Lieberman and co-founder Austin Rief have built Morning Brew from a dorm-room project to a $75 million media company in less than six years, becoming one of the go-to sources for millennials seeking business news. The company has already grown considerably from its initial daily newsletter, and last year, it sold a majority stake to media-company Insider that should provide substantial funds to continue that expansion.

On Jan. 16, Lieberman joined Motley Fool marketing manager Margaret Powell on Motley Fool Live to discuss a broad range of topics, including the strategies he and Rief used to grow the business in the early days and the lessons he learned guiding his young company through the pandemic. A full transcript follows the video.


10 stocks we like better than Walmart
When investing geniuses David and Tom Gardner have an investing tip, it can pay to listen. After all, the newsletter they have run for over a decade, Motley Fool Stock Advisor, has tripled the market.*

David and Tom just revealed what they believe are the ten best stocks for investors to buy right now… and Walmart wasn't one of them! That's right -- they think these 10 stocks are even better buys.

See the 10 stocks

Stock Advisor returns as of 2/1/20



Margaret Powell: Hi Fools. Everyone on Motley Fool Live, thank you for joining us today. I'm Margaret, and I work on our marketing here at The Fool. We have a super-exciting guest today. We have Alex Lieberman, from Morning Brew, co-founder of this business newsletter. Almost six years old, over 2 million subscribers. [laughs] We're super excited to have you today. I'm especially excited because actually our partnership with Morning Brew is part of my team's work. Thank you for joining us today.

Alex Lieberman: Yeah. No, thanks for having me and thanks for the introduction. It's been a fun 5 1/2 years since starting this when I was a senior in college and my co-founder Austin was a sophomore in college. Also, we're just super pumped to be partners of The Fool for a number of years now. I think, when I think about some of our partnerships that have evolved in a really meaningful way and an exciting way, I think entirely about The Fool. From, like, in the early days, individual newsletter placements to tell The Fool story, all the way now to a way more holistic thing as Morning Brew becomes a media brand and not just a newsletter company. I'm super excited to be here. Thanks for having me.

Powell: Absolutely. Yeah. It's a really exciting partnership for our team. I think we've been partners for a little bit over a year in the newsletter space. It really has grown to such a dynamic partnership, and really a content partnership, and not just advertising.

Lieberman: 100%.

Powell: To kick things off today, for anyone watching Motley Fool Live, who might not yet be a subscriber, give us the quick rundown of what is Morning Brew.

Lieberman: Yeah, for sure. Morning Brew's goal at the highest level is to empower the modern business leader with engaging and accessible content. My more irreverent, shorter answer is, business news and business content isn't sexy, or at least it hasn't been sexy in the ways that traditional media brands have talked about the business world. Our goal is to make it sexy and enjoyable for an entire generation of people that are going to run companies and run countries in the next five to 10 years. To us, the big insight in starting this business was when we were in college. We would ask students when prepping them for job interviews, "How do you keep up with the business world?" and every student would say something along the lines of, "I read the Wall Street Journal and I read it because I feel like I have to because it's a prerequisite" -- they go on and on. At some point we were like, "This is crazy. These kids are working their a--es off to have careers in business. They're literally going to spend the ages of 28-60 plus -- or 40 years, 50 percent of your life for those 40 years working in business. They deserve to have content that they love and that motivates them." That was the beginning insight.

The OG product of Morning Brew is a product that we still have today -- that is our marquee product. It's our daily newsletter, sent out six days a week to 2.5 million people. A million unique opens a day. I think it makes it the largest daily newsletter in the country or second largest. The way that we've grown in the business since launching the newsletter in 2015 is basically with this obsession about a very specific type of person -- we call the modern business leader. This intellectually curious, deeply aspirational and career-oriented, millennial professional. If you track the progression of Morning Brew and all of the products that we've launched, it's always about how can we further serve that psychographic. Now Morning Brew has seven products across B2B and B2C. We have several newsletters. So on the B2B side, we have Marketing Brew for marketing professionals, Retail Brew for retail professionals, Emerging Tech Brew for emerging technology professionals. On the B2C side, we have our daily newsletter, we have Sidekick, which is our most recent product. It's a lifestyle newsletter because professionals also have lives. It's this crazy concept -- we also care about that outside of work. The point of that product is to serve the life of business professionals. We have our podcast, Business Casual, which is an interview podcast of the biggest names in the business world. It gets 150,000 downloads a week. Over 2021, what you're going to see is Morning Brew truly becoming a media brand and not just a newsletter company, where we start really placing bets in things like multimedia, video and audio shows, actually building out a website that isn't just the landing page that you put your email address in. We're super excited about it.

Powell: That's really exciting. A lot of cool growth coming in 2021 for you guys. I think when I think about what stood out to me about Morning Brew as I've learned about it over the years, is that insane, crazy fast-growth. I personally think one of the key parts of that, when I look at it as a consumer of Morning Brew, is this robust referral program. Can you share a little bit about the referral program and how did that come to be? What was that inspired by and what role has that played in the growth of the subscriber base?

Lieberman: Yeah, for sure. I'll talk about the referral program, and then I will talk about this concept that I called the balloon effect, which is how I think a lot of companies grow or the type of trajectory in which a lot of companies grow. The referral program has been probably our most important lever that we pulled to grow. Other than our college ambassador program when we first started, our referral program was the first thing that we launched to get the flywheel going of people who read Morning Brew and feel passion about it, sharing with other people. The high levels that more than 300,000 of Morning Brew subscribers -- so obviously more than 10 percent of our subscribers -- have gotten at least one referral. When you think about that, it's pretty crazy. Because if I wasn't running our media business and specifically a newsletter business, I would never be the person to read a newsletter, get to the bottom, see a referral link, say, "I get to earn a hat or a bottle opener, with that referral link." Go share that with my friends, gets them to sign up to earn the stuff like that was never going to be my behavior. The fact that 300,000 people have done that is pretty remarkable. The referral program still continues to be a massive driver because it makes every new subscriber worth more than just one subscriber. Just to give kind of insight into it at specific referral checkpoints, so when you get people in your network to sign up for Morning Brew through your link, you'll earn rewards. You can earn anything from our Sunday edition of the newsletter, which is called Light Roast, to stickers to a Brew mug to a Brew crew neck, which we call a Brewneck. Basically our view was, let's come up with rewards that do two things. One, reward our most passionate readers who are going to want to wear the Brew on their bodies as like a sign of being a VIP in the club. Then the second thing is come up with rewards that don't cost a lot but mean a lot to people. So how can we acquire new subscribers not super expensively but reward with things that mean a lot to people? I'll give you an example like Light Roast, which is our Sunday edition of the Brew. It rewards our best readers with great content, but the cost of producing Light Roast obviously isn't super high. It's a writer's worth of time over a year. Same thing with a mug. People think mugs are expensive. I think our mugs costs $0.25 a mug. When you back into the cost of acquiring new subscribers by giving away mugs, it's very low. The referral program has been great for us. The last thing I'll say is this idea of the balloon effect, which I've read about is, I think the Morning Brew has experienced this. I think that even in some ways, it's something that The Fool has experienced over The Fool's history.

When I think about famous YouTubers like MrBeast or David Dobrik, the way that the balloon effect works is, a company is relentlessly focused on creating great products and getting customers organically for a long period of time. So let's say a business has been around for 10 years. Basically, the idea of the balloon effect, just for eight of those years, the business isn't getting a lot of recognition, it ain't that massive yet, it's growing gradually and linearly, but it hasn't exploded yet. Almost like this process of filling up a water balloon in the sink. When you're holding the faucet open, that's all the work you need to do to fill up the balloon. You never know when the balloon is getting a pop, but when it does pop, you clearly know when it pops -- water goes everywhere. I think there's this concept of there's a tipping point, which you've produced enough great product, enough people are talking about you through word of mouth. Then something clicks, something pops, and all of a sudden, the growth in your business is exponential. I think when we look at Morning Brew, that has been the last year-and-a-half for us. Before that point, for 3 1/2 or four years prior to that, it was very much like no one knew us. We were creating a nice business and it exploded into a significantly larger business.

Powell: Yeah. It definitely seems like even that balloon effect in the referral program in and of itself took Morning Brew, in my opinion, from maybe a five-minute read in your daily inbox every morning to a part of your life and a part of your overall experience of consuming content on the internet. I think you touched on something a little bit earlier that's really interesting, and something that we've taken up here, as well, which is that business news and financial content has, like, not always historically had the reputation of being super user-friendly. It's thought to have a lot of jargon and maybe being, like, less successful, the everyday person. You know that we at The Fool have taken on the approach of making everything (as we say capitalized) Foolish and fun and informative as possible. I think Morning Brew really does that. How do you guys approach taking business news, like you said, traditionally not the most exciting piece of content in the inbox every morning and making it this exciting, easily consumable, user-friendly experience?

Lieberman: Yeah, totally. I would say the first is having a team that truly buys into that concept, that buys into that business is actually fascinating. I'm always fascinated by the idea of every day I learn about a new business and it's just so interesting. No one has effectively told the story of that business. I'll give you an example -- Oatly, the oatmeal company. Oatly's story is fascinating and not enough people know the story. The fact that it's been around since 1999, it was started in a research institute in Sweden. It was a tiny business, literally until 2014. Now, it's a $2 billion company because a new CEO came in, rebranded the company, focused on marketing through tea, coffee shops first, and then growing out of that. To me, it's like that story and that journey just isn't talked about enough that everyone will find it fascinating. The first is just having people on our team that are nerds like me and like Austin, and truly find it interesting just the stories of businesses. I think the second thing is the voice that we deployed in the business. We have been so relentlessly focused on developing a very specific voice and codifying that voice where, literally, we have document. It's almost the Coca-Cola secret recipe, that talk through like who the brew if the Morning Brew was a person? Who that person is? We've literally codified how old this person is, where they live, the type of cocktails they like, how many days a week they go out. Whether they like TED Talks more than reading 10-Ks. Like in excruciating detail, we've written the profile of this fake person because I think it allows our writers to truly understand -- what is the persona that they're embodying when they write? I think the other thing we've done a good job of is, as we've gone from one newsletter through several newsletters and podcasts, we've been really thoughtful about how do we port this tone into different parts of the business, but also recognize that people have individual and independent voices. Like our retail brew writer, or marketing brew writer, or emerging-tech brew writer, all have different ways of writing and different voices than our daily newsletter writers. But there is a way to have different voices but still have the same tone. It's like the fact that Alex, I'm one person, but the way that I'm communicating on this conversation right now, versus with my girlfriend five minutes from now, versus when I'm in a board meeting with Business Insider -- I'm the same person, but the way I communicate is different. I think that's how we think about tone versus voice within our company.

Powell: I think as you expanded beyond the newsletter business into other types of media, has there been a specific challenge, especially maybe even relating to podcast, and keeping that brand consistent as you've grown outside of the newsletter space?

Lieberman: I think the hardest thing is, at least with podcasting, our first product outside of newsletter is a podcast. It's not that just taking your voice into podcasting is hard. Like that's a given -- it's going to be hard to port your voice in different ways. But I think it's the fact that it is an interview podcast. Two days a week, Kinsey Grant, who has her own voice, is interviewing a guest, whether it's Mark Cuban, Barbara Corcoran, Meg Whitman, Reed Hastings, etc., who has another voice. I think when you just think about the dynamic of an interview podcast, 40 minutes, Kinsey is maybe spending 15% of the interview talking and then 85% of it is the guests. I think this new layer that we didn't have to think about with newsletters that we have to think about now, is how do you find voices and guests that are on brand for Morning Brew's interview series? Just because someone is CEO or just because someone is a billionaire doesn't actually mean that they will evoke the tone of the Morning Brew. It's so important when they're spending 85% of the conversation being the one speaking.

Powell: You mentioned something earlier that it's a good pivot to a topic I want to hit on -- which is Insider. Quite notably this past year, Insider came onboard as the majority stakeholder of Morning Brew. I was hoping you could share a little bit with us about what that process has meant for the brand and the product suite?

Lieberman: Yes. I feel like this answer always disappoints people, but, like, really nothing [laughs] has changed. It's boring. Like in the sense that, I'm sitting in the same office in my grandparents' apartment doing the same exact thing I was doing six months ago. I think to most people on our team, they haven't seen the impact yet. What I mean by that is, I think there are going to be ways for Insider and the Brew to partner, where we can draft off of the resources of a billion-dollar company and then their owner who is a multibillion-dollar company. But we're in the early days of the partnership. I don't think people have seen that yet. Where I think things have changed, honestly, just more structure. Again, this is just like me being nerdy, but as a first-time founder, as somebody who is naturally creative, who naturally is, like, 50 thoughts going on at once, I think being forced into a little bit more structure, I think is important for me to mature as a leader. What I mean by that is, like, we do quarterly board meetings now. We have to present to the board, which includes Austin, my co-founder, and myself, folks from Business Insider, and we meet them biweekly, as well. I think that forces Austin and I to just be a little bit more structured in our thinking, and also be more forward thinking in how we plan not just next six months for the business, for the next year, three years, and five years. Eighteen months ago, our plan was a week ahead. Like now, we're truly mapping out what three years from today, revenuewise, headcountwise, productwise looks like for Morning Brew, and I think the partnership is forcing us to do that. Some areas that we talk about partnering together are everything from our advertising business. How can we partner with Business Insider to sell larger, more holistic packages, getting in front of different but complementary audiences across all of our ecosystems? All the way to how can we leverage Business Insider's top of funnel of hundreds of millions of people, uniques under our website, a month to drive to be Morning Brew subscribers. Those are some of the partnership conversations that we've been having.

Powell: Even just looking back at the past year as that was in the works, obviously, it's been a really unique and challenging landscape, and, like, the pandemic is playing such a huge role in that. Over the past 12 calendar months in 2020, how did the pandemic change your approach to marketing and selling ad space? There was [inaudible] going on in this past year, and that has definitely affected our approach. What does that look like on your side?

Lieberman: What I will first say is that I think 2020, it was a year, but it was like 10 years in leadership training and management training. I have my own podcasts called Founder's Journal, which I'm spending a lot of time building up, and the episode I recorded last night was my lessons in crisis leadership. I thought it was a time no one, given obviously everything that happened at the Capitol literally two days ago, just when we thought the craziness of 2020 was gone, it's become the 13-month year. I thought it was a good opportunity to talk about lessons from the last year-and-a-half of, even though our first-time founder, that I've had to just understand how to lead a company during crisis and during turmoil. A few examples of crises that have happened with our own business are what happened at the Capitol, the acquisition with Insider because any time an acquisition happens, it's obviously going to cause questions for everyone in the company, to the killing of George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, and so many others, and everything around the BLM movement communicating to our organization during that. Honestly, it was a year that made every leader grow up and become better at navigating their company and communicating. As it relates to our advertising business, we ended up finishing out the year, hitting our exact goal that we wanted to hit, that we stated in December of 2019 prior to knowing about the pandemic. Things ended up working out in a really good way. But to say that we weren't affected by the pandemic will be a lie, especially in March or April. March or April was an absolute s--- show in the sense that I had never experienced what panic and fear did to an ad business. There was a period of 72 hours where ad dollars literally just vanished. I vividly remember, it was March 15th when we left the city, we're all going to go to remote work. At 9 p.m., the night before a big sponsor who was to do a full takeover on our newsletter, that was probably, I can't remember, it was a multi-five-figure deal, they pulled out, and they pulled out of that deal. That was the first, and then just that was the first shoe to drop. Then these dominoes continue to partners just saying:

We have no idea what's happening in the world right now. We don't know what this coronavirus is, but it's scary. We don't have a choice, but to put our marketing budgets on hold, we're literally doing nothing. We're just freezing everything.

There was a period of a week to a week-and-a-half. Austin and I were, like, this is wild, what are we going to do? Just make sure we can pay our people. Not because it got that bad, but because the momentum of ad dollars leaving the door. Austin and I were, like, "We've never seen momentum like this before." Austin and I were having conversations about every possible way that we can monetize Morning Brew's audience outside of advertising. From starting a Patreon to partnering with universities on selling courses to literally coming out with merchant swag and selling swag, things started to normalize in late April, but between middle of March and middle of April, it definitely aged founders and managers.

Powell: The environment last spring in the marketing space, every day was such a question mark of, "What would things look like in the ad landscape, what would happen with digital?" Totally agree, it was a wild time. I think you've touched on something really important, which is the responsibility that founders, CEOs have internally to their own employees. I think being there for those people has been an even more heightened responsibility this year than in previous years. One thing on my own personal experience with Morning Brew has been amazing experiences working with people on the team.

Lieberman: Awesome to hear.

Powell: Yeah, absolutely. And when you think about the team that you have cultivated this year in one of the most challenging years, and probably a lot of hard conversations to be had with your team, what has that looked like, and when you think about growing a team and hiring during these types of advertising environments, what has that experience been?

Lieberman: Again, it's been a learning experience. Just to share a few of the lessons that I've had and again, this is what I talked about in Founder's Journal. I'd encourage anyone to just go and listen to it because I won't do the whole episode justice. Basically, the first thing was not going into hiding. The worst thing that a leader or a manager can do during a time of crisis or concern is not say anything, and especially in a remote environment where you're not in an office, where your team doesn't see you, to not be present on Slack or Zoom or email. I think the reason it's so bad is because employees will look at the environment, will be like, "Okay, crazy stuff is going down, is our business going to be OK? Are there going to be layoffs?" Imagine, if you look to your manager, or you look to your leader and you hear nothing. You hear no statement in Slack, you hear nothing in All Hands, and you continue to have to wonder for yourself. I think this sends the message to team members that you are on your own, figure it out for yourself. I also think, generally, we as human beings are story-making machines -- when we don't know all the information, we fill in the information with what we want to fill them with, and I think that leads to a lot of momentum and potentially not true narratives. I'd say the first thing was, like, not going into hiding, showing our team we were present. That goes into the second thing, which is being humble, at least as a young founder. I think it was so important early on to not come off as someone who has had hundreds of raps at this. I think early on, with any of these crises, saying to our team, "We are going to do our very best, to push the company forward to communicate to our team." We want to be clear, they're going to be points where we mess up, where we mess up in the decisions we make and all we can promise is to do what we believe is right by this company and the right thing is people. I think that's such an important thing to do, to disarm people and can connect with them. Because I truly believe unless you're like Dara, who runs Uber and who's run several companies, it's impossible to manage crises perfectly. I think disarming people or letting people know that you're trying your best and you're going to make mistakes gives you the permission not to want to make mistakes, but when you do make them, you at least have told people that you're not perfect. I think that's another big one.

The final thing I'll say is customizing care. Being a leader or being a manager is like being a doctor. Imagine if you treated every patient with the exact same diagnosis and the exact same bedside manner. Every employee enjoys being communicated to in a certain way, every employee has different levels of confidence and questions and the need to be reassured, and so I'd say the other thing is finding ways to communicate in a scalable way with everyone at the company level. Then finding ways to prioritize speaking to the people who will benefit most from being spoken to you in a one-on-one manner in a way that you can customize your care.

Powell: You mentioned that you being a first-time founder and young founder, probably the growth and the experiences you had over this year have been so pivotal. When you look back to like five years or 5 3/4 years ago [laughs] when the group first started, is there one thing that you know now about running a business that you absolutely wish you could have told yourself five years ago?

Lieberman: The biggest thing that I would say is, be great at thinking about the second-order effects of your decisions. I think as young founders, young professionals, it is so easy to think about a decision based on what you know now and whether that decision makes sense or not. I think what I found is, the best leaders that I've ever spoken to are thinking four steps ahead. I'll give you an example. We're working on hiring a director of social right now Morning Brew. The easy decision to make or I would say the way I used to think about it as saying, OK, Morning Brew, we want to build up our brand social accounts, we want to build up our Instagram account, we want to build up a Twitter account, we probably are going to want to launch to TikTok and saying, OK, for that to do that job, who is the best person to hire? We'll probably end up picking someone who is maybe in their mid- to late-twenties, has managed one or two people managing accounts, then that's it. The issue is if I don't take it a step further and say, "Okay, great, but what about a year from now, what about two years from now? What about when Morning Brew has four or five Multimedia Products? What about when not only do we have those multimedia products, but those multimedia products have personalities also. Like Alex has his podcast, Kinsey has her podcast, and we have four other personalities. Who is going to need to be the director of social that is managing the social accounts for eight shows, three morning rebranded accounts, and eight personalities? Isn't that the same person that'll be running the team when we have two or three accounts? Most of the time the answer is no. I think in the early days, we wouldn't think about it that way, and so we would hire someone who is right today and maybe for the next three to six months, but not maybe right for a year to two years from now.

Powell: You've actually spoken on before, really the importance of hiring and how bad hires have that trickle-down effect. Can you speak on that a little bit here in building a [inaudible]? What does it look like to bring on people that think those four steps ahead about the brand and the product?

Lieberman: Yes, if I didn't just share that lesson around thinking two or three steps ahead. The second lesson I would share is that you can't spend too much time thinking about people. Thinking about the right way you hire people, thinking about the roles you need to hire for, thinking about how you develop people and retain them. I just don't think as a leader, you can spend too much time on that. I think the biggest thing we learned in making mis-hires is it generally came down to two things. Actually, sorry, three things. Hiring someone too quickly, where basically what happens is we run a hiring process, we go through two months or three months in the process. It doesn't work out, so we have to restart the hiring process, and we find someone who is pretty good, two weeks into that new process. Because we're mentally exhausted for looking for someone for this role for three months or for two months, we end up pulling the trigger on hiring that person. Every time that behavior has existed for us, we have made the wrong decision, and honestly, it ends up leading to that person no longer being at the company six or eight months in the future. And it's not only not fair to ourselves, it's not fair to the people that we mis-hire.

I would say the second thing is hiring anyone we know. Every time we have had any friends or friends of friends in the business, it has not worked out ever -- like ever, ever. The other thing that I would say is taking basically a bunch of things that need to get done in the company now, where, like, you're talking to your current team members and you have one person who's saying: "These three things. I want them to get done. But they're not exactly my job description, but they should get done," and then having another person say the same thing. You basically find a list of nine things that need to get that done, you match those into a role that you hire for, and what you end up realizing is you hire someone to do nine things that were never a top priority so there probably was a reason you didn't hire someone to do that. Those are the three big learnings I've had from hiring and I would say the other big thing is, no one fires fast enough. Human beings hate tension; human beings strive to be empathetic and good people. I think that is the antithesis of what needs to be done when you realize someone's not right for a role. By the way, when I realize someone is not right for a role, it takes me far too long to let someone go, also. It is a very tough thing to do. But if I could give one piece of advice to everyone, including myself, it will be let people go in the most humane and empathetic way, but as fast as possible because I believe you're doing disservice to your company and to the person. Once you get to the point that you feel you've given every chance for someone to succeed in a row and it's just not going to happen, they're not the right person. To me, what happens is one, it's not right for the company because things won't be pushed forward as fast as they should be. Also, if you think someone's not right for the role, you're never going to be the only one. Other people in the company will have the same exact thoughts, and the longer you keep that person, other people will question why is management keeping somebody we don't think is effective enough in the role. I think one, it hurts the credibility that you have with your team. What I think the second is, is it's a disservice to the person that you ultimately are going to let go. Because if you don't think that they're going to grow in the company, you're literally slowing down their ability to progress in their career because you know that they're not going to be able to escalate in your company.

Powell: I think that's a really important point. We absolutely hear the Fool have had such a focus for a really long time on really being committed to being detail oriented with that hiring process, thinking about it long term, because we always say our people are our most valuable asset.

Lieberman: Yeah, 100%. 

Powell: I want to close us down today with one last question for you, since we're out of time. In thinking ahead, if you're at Motley Fool Live in January 2022, and when you're looking back, how are you going to measure success this year? What is it [inaudible]?

Lieberman: Yeah, for sure. If I had to encapsulate it, one analogy, if I did the same exercise today and I did the same exercise a year from now or even two years from now -- what it would be is I would go to downtown Manhattan, I would randomly pick 10 people and I would ask them, do you know what Morning Brew is? My view is that probably right now, given if you're in downtown Manhattan, you're probably close to the financial districts or you're already talking to a pretty concentrated audience of people who probably know what the Brew is. My guess is 7 out of 10 people would say they know what it is. Then, if I asked the seven people, what is Morning Brew? I think the answer right now would look pretty different for everyone. I think some people would say, ''It's the business version of The Skin.'' Some people would say, ''It's that business newsletter.'' Some people would say, ''It's that collection of newsletters," and a small group will say, ''It's that business media company that does newsletters, it does podcasts, and it's huge on Twitter now.'' If I do the same exercise at this point next year, my view is that first of all, instead of 7 out of 10 people saying that they know Morning Brew is, it's 9 out of 10, and that the majority of the group says what the minority had said in the previous example, which is Morning Brew is synonymous with the word business. When I think of a business medium brand that services the modern business leader in all places, that the modern business leader consumes content, that's your Morning Brew is to me. If we can see those results literally conducting that study and see that story evolve, it means that we have executed on a product plan and a branding around that product to evolve the story. Because you can evolve the story without evolving the product in the right way.

Powell: Well, we're going to be excited to check in with you on that next year. My team especially is really thrilled to continue growing our digital partnership with Morning Brew.

Lieberman: Totally.

Powell: Absolutely. That is all the questions we had for you, Alex. Thank you so much for taking the time to join us on Motley Fool Live and share with our members. We're so appreciative to have you here.

Lieberman: Thanks so much for having me. I'm super appreciative of so many people at the Fool that I've spoken with just casually, and super appreciative for your guys' partnership, and excited for what both companies are going to build over the coming years. Thanks so much and hope everyone has a great weekend.